Has anyone heard of bad gasoline being distributed in the Midwest this summer/early fall? I am just speculating, but I have had a rash of half plugged catalytic converters at the end of summer and into the early fall. I have had at least 6 half plugged converters in the last 3 months. The converters were not completely plugged, but just enough that the owner knew something was not right. These were on different brands and models, with the explanation that the power loss happened suddenly. Like runs OK today and suddenly starts to struggle tomorrow. I don't think it is the two stations in our town because these customers tend to buy fuel near their out of town jobs to the south. That and our two stations are pretty high volume, so I would have seen more failures in this locale if it was those stations. We have Marathon and Phillips 66. Maybe a coincidence, but thought I would ask.
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I havent heard of any problems with bad gas in that respect but I wouldn't doubt we get some of the raw / poor quality stuff here, were just "hicks in the sticks" you know lol. The last couple years my mileage on 3 different vehicles has gone down 2-4 mpg. One car is a 1999 and the other a 2001, both the same make and engine model. Ive went from getting 30-32 down to 27-29 mpg with them. Winter mileage always went down to the 26-28 range but lately has been down to 22 or 23. In the last few years, if the oil companies can get away with making poorer quality gas and shaving off a little on the mpg end but not raise the price, they can make more money.
Gary Mitchell
Well-known Member
Could they be putting enough alcohol in the gas that it isn't burning hot enough in cool weather to make the convertor work properly?
Mike in Mn.
Member
Know of two plugged this summer, car is down about 2 to 3 miles per gallon also this summer, I use a few gas tractors and I noticed they idle a little smokey this summer and I use no alcohol premium for farm gas.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Some years ago around here a waste disposal company was under cutting most other disposal companies to get rid of PCB oil. The same company also owned some "mom and pop" gas stations.
Turns out the disposal company was filtering the PCB oil then blending a few % with highway gasoline and diesel fuel.
Indiana Ken
Well-known Member
I had a 1979 Mustang that plugged a converter. I attributed it to oil burning. I had been adding a quart (maybe two) between changes. It happened very quickly. I could tell something was wrong on the way home from work. By the time I pulled into the drive it would barely go. Full throttle in neutral, the engine would run up to 2000 RPM. I drilled several holes in the pipe ahead of the converter to drive to work the next day.
Think about it - converter plugging is similar to a filter. One hole plugs and it is no big deal as there are thousands more. Get down to 10 holes and each time a hole plugs the capacity is reduced by 10%.... and so on. I call this the "toilet paper model". When you get to the end of the roll it goes fast.
Switchflicker
Member
Am I correct to believe that Premium gasoline in the USA as well as Canada does not have any ethanol added what-so-ever?
Thanks
Sw
Geo-TH,In
Well-known Member
I heard of a rumor where a gas station in Florida got caught adding water to their gasoline expecting the water to mix with the ethanol, e10, so they could sell a water ethanol blend.
My brother was driving his motor home from Florida to Indiana. Half way back his CC was choked. He did an emergency repair, cut the CC out to make it back to Indiana.
The CC on my GMC truck started rattling. I replaced it before it plugged my exhaust. I also had to replace CC on a car years ago.
My mother had a similar problem when she was living in Texas. So, is it ethanol or are CC prone to having issues?
My brother was driving his motor home from Florida to Indiana. Half way back his CC was choked. He did an emergency repair, cut the CC out to make it back to Indiana.
The CC on my GMC truck started rattling. I replaced it before it plugged my exhaust. I also had to replace CC on a car years ago.
My mother had a similar problem when she was living in Texas. So, is it ethanol or are CC prone to having issues?
CenTex Farmall
Well-known Member
Was their secondary goal population control?
Hobo,NC
Well-known Member
- Location
- Sanford, NC
What test confirmed a 1/2 plunged converter... :?:
Its not really a "blame it on ethanol" situation, almost all gasoline has ethanol in it now so when problems arise that could be related to fuel quality then its safe to consider that ethanol might be a contributor. There is a growing problem of people having premature failures and research is starting to point to the negative effects of ethanol with vehicles. Believe in what you want, good or bad, but if you want to research this yourself you will find many people are reporting problems and many tests have been conducted on the adverse effects of ethanol.
Several things can play into why we might be seeing higher failure rates. I wont go into to great big detail here but you can find articles, data and test results with a little research on negative effects of ethanol fuel, a few of them are listed below. Other possibilties could be from cheap made components, engines out of tune or other driveability problems.
1. Ethanol fuel that makes its way past the piston rings reacts with engine oil which extracts phosphorus from the oil and then it's drawn through the PCV system and engine. The phosphorus basically coats oxygen sensors and the catalyst causing failure. This scenario increases for engines that consume more oil. This problem also occurs more when using bio-ethanol which has been increasing in popularity.
2. Ethanol fuel molecules contain one extra oxygen atom, if this gets picked up by the oxygen sensor the fuel system will lean out causing even hotter combustion and exhaust temps. Ethanol already burns hotter than gas and more heat means reduced life.
3. Ethanol fuel is somewhat acidic, it also attracts water which is also acidic and corrosive. So with more ethanol you will get more water, acidity and corrosion.
1. Ethanol fuel that makes its way past the piston rings reacts with engine oil which extracts phosphorus from the oil and then it's drawn through the PCV system and engine. The phosphorus basically coats oxygen sensors and the catalyst causing failure. This scenario increases for engines that consume more oil. This problem also occurs more when using bio-ethanol which has been increasing in popularity.
2. Ethanol fuel molecules contain one extra oxygen atom, if this gets picked up by the oxygen sensor the fuel system will lean out causing even hotter combustion and exhaust temps. Ethanol already burns hotter than gas and more heat means reduced life.
3. Ethanol fuel is somewhat acidic, it also attracts water which is also acidic and corrosive. So with more ethanol you will get more water, acidity and corrosion.
No you are not correct.
If anything, much of the "premium" gasoline has MORE ethanol in it than regular. Ethanol is very high in octane and cheap. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that the bean counters at the oil companies have figured this out, and are using it to maximize profits.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Tell us how ethanol with a max flame temperature of 3488 F burns hotter than gasoline with a max flame temperature of 5021 F ?
Water has a neutral PH until something bonds with it.
Do not take half plugged literally. What I mean is these cars will seem to run normally, unless they are pushed hard. When pushed hard for passing or during a WOT from a dead stop, they lack power at the top of the power band and start to whistle. When removed and cut open, with a light behind the honeycomb brick, several of the chambers are plugged. They almost appear as if something has caused particles to come through the engine. The brick is not melted, as the chambers are intact on the inlet side, just plugged. I define fully plugged as the engine won't start or only idles, these cars will perform normally if driven lightly. New converters fix them all.
DaninKansas
Member
CCs have been issues since they were first put on cars back in the 1970s.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Too much putting around driving and not enough foot to the floor acceleration up the freeway ramp then cruising at 70mph.
Well I wasnt talking about flame temps of the fuels, I was talking about the actual combustion temps in the cylinders. Ethanol used as a fuel tends to run lean in gasoline engines, if your vehicle does not know what or how much ethanol is in the fuel then the mixture will be lean and therefore burn hotter.
Water in the almost every environment is lower than 7 PH, or acidic, when water is exposed to air it will become more acidic along with when water temperature increases its PH lowers.
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