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Intellegence -vs- education... are they equal?

N

NCWayne

Well-known Member
A friend of mine stopped by last night and, as usual, we got to talking. He got here around 7PM and didn"t leave until nearly 11:30PM. During that time we talked about everything under the sun and, as it usually does, time just flew by. Due to work schedules, etc, he and I don"t see each other that often, and as he was leaving he made the comment that, "It was nice to have a real intelligent conversation on occasion".

That comment, and various other things we had discussed in our talk, got me to thinking, in a round about way, about the question posed in the subject line. I say round about because my line of thinking was basically how many friends I have that I can have a real, "intelligent" conversation with and the vast differences in their education.

I say vast because in the circle of guys I call friends there are guys with educational histories from one extreme to the other. On one side are the guys like my Father. He grew up on a tobacco farm, and only has a tenth grade education. Even so when it comes to discussing just about anything, he is one of the smartest people I know. Heck in the equipment repair arena, he has probably forgotten more about working on equipment than I know right now.

On the other side of the circle are guys like the friend that was over last night, and another that was over a few nights ago. Both of them have degrees in the engineering disciplines. One I know is in mechanical engineering and the other, I believe (just realized I had never really asked) on the electrical side of things given his past work history. Neither are working in their fields right now, one because he works for the family business, and the other because he "did his thing" for quite a few years, and made decent money, and now simply enjoys doing other things.

Personally I finished high school and took a few college level courses in diesel engine repair. I then spent 6 years in the Navy where I had over a year of advanced courses in a variety of areas, to make me better at my job. Beyond that I simply ask questions, read a lot, pay attention to what"s going on around me, and love to just dig in and figure out and solve problems. I guess on the formal education side of things I don"t fall that far from my Dad as I only graduated high school and have no degrees from any type of college.

That all said, the differences in formal education seems to be what way too many employers now days look at when they go to hire someone. The thing is they never seem to realize that the fact you don"t have a degree (like they do) doesn"t mean you aren"t as good, or better at your job, or even theirs, as they are. Usually the OJT received teaches far more, in many ways, than years of college could ever teach.

Don"t take this to mean that I think college, or degrees, are bad in any way. I understand the need for folks with the real, in-depth, knowledge achieved by going to school. The problem with many of them though is that their knowledge only extends as far as their education, and they have no practical knowledge beyond that. At the same time we also need folks from the other side of the circle that, even though they don"t have the formal education, have more practical knowledge than any kind of formal education can over offer.

Now, my question for ya"ll. Who is the most intelligent person you know, and what kind of education do they have? Basically, are they book smart/intelligent, or OJT smart, or one of the lucky few that are both?

Oh......... for you degreed guys, who are also pretty smart otherwise......yeah I been on here long enough, and seen enough conversations, to know there are a lot of you out there..... I don't want you to say "Me" (meaning yourself).......LOL
 
You can not educate someone that does not have intelligence. Many People with degrees do not have knowledge beyond their education. Their field of study is often their focus in life. I say intelligence, trumps education. But good luck getting that thru to HR Personnel
 
If your basic question boils down to "Do you have to have a college education to be intelligent?", the answer is "Of course not." Intelligence is the accumulation of knowledge. The ability to comprehend information, make proper judgments and take proper actions based on that information demonstrates what you're really talking about, Intellect.

Obviously, advanced education is necessary to become proficient in any number of disciplines--medicine, engineering, science, law, finance, etc., but without the basic intellectual capacity it's not likely an individual will progress very far in those areas.

So, is that basic intellectual capacity (IQ, if you will) the product of nature or nuture? The question is often debated, but I believe it has to be there at birth, and then nurtured. The harsh truth is that none of as are born exactly equal, and some folks just have minds that are wired better than others.

I have observed, however, that intellect and advanced education do not necessarily produce that thing called "wisdom". We all know or know of highly-educated idiots totally lacking in common sense. Washington is full of them.

I am convinced that the capacity to learn, to understand, to discern, to strive and to succeed depends on some other inate traits that some people have and some people do not---things like character, pride, courage, determination, and a willingness to try harder and to work harder. It is these people, who have attempted, failed, and attempted again--and again--and ultimately succeed, who get my vote as intelligent.
 
You misunderstand why employers expect a college degree from job applicants. In most cases, it has little to do with the education and skills one receives in a college education. Rather, it's a litmus test as to whether the applicant will be able to take on responsibilities and complete difficult tasks without a lot of supervision. It's not a particularly good test, but in these days where there are plenty of applicants for every job, employers can put up lots of hurdles and still be left with many applicants after screening. In many cases, they screen out the best applicants, but that's the way it goes. No different than turning away a job applicant for wearing dreadlocks or excessive tattoos; the rules only need to make sense for those who enforce them.
 
I'll take a shot at this.
First Yes I'm "educated" have Master of Science in Physics and another in Management; I didn't try to get a Doctorate, I could have but I noticed that degree seems to change people and that wasn't/isn't desirable. Spent 30+ years working for the Navy and another 10+ supporting the Navy Engineers.
To the question!
Intelligence and education are not equal. Without intelligence a person cannot fully apply the education he/she obtains. Education is obtain two ways--going to school and learning from those that have experienced issues in the field and the other is going to work and becoming educated by experiencing the issues. Your Dad for example learned by doing and, I don't know if he is still living, by now has a pretty impressive education. I have/had an Uncle that went blind but even blind could repair cars better than most mechanics of today.
So INTELLIGENCE is the God given ability to reason what equipment/people are doing/showing, determine the real issue and correct it (maybe with people). Education is adding to one's knowledge base so that one can apply their intelligence across a broader spectrum.
Did I express myself right?
 
it varries by the individual, i know some common type people with a vocational education that are almost brilliant, and ive known 3 or 4 with several masters degrees each that i wouldnt allow around machinery without supervision,
 
The more people I meet in the world the more I love my dog....
Sorry that quote hit me when I first read your post. I have many good friends from college. Being 23 and a new college grad we enter the world thinking we know a lot(I apologize, I don't know why my generation has this attitude). When we get hit in the face with the real world it is quite the humbling experience. Now I'm no dummy, I work hard, read, and do a lot of stuff to better myself but I don't consider myself smart. Just very aware of things. With that being said one of the smartest people I knew never went to college, worked all his life and had forgotten more about carpentry, woodworking, and general trades then i could ever hope to know. An education helps but it doesn't mean you are intelligent. I know one to many that have degrees but I question their level of intelligence. Sorry for the long post.
 
Two of the smartest men I ever knew didn't have a lot of education ,but had a lot of common sense. They could built or fix anything they wanted to do. I think education is important, but I would rather depend on someone with common sense for everyday dealings. I've seen some educated people who couldn't pour p!!s out of a boot without instructions. Tommy
 
I grew up in the 50s. That was a time when people who had some blue-collar skills used them for income and did opt to go to college (generally speaking). The people who had no skills - and/or no interest - pursued academia to some degree.

Not quite the same now. A four-year degrees is hardly anything more then what a high school diploma was 40 years ago. Go read Einsteins's book (that he personally wrote) on his theory of Special Relativity. He especially wrote it "geared down" so the average high school grad could understand. All I can say - is wow - they must of made high school grads different when old Albert was around!

I barely finished high school whereas my brother went to MIT and never really left. (I went later when in my late 40s). I can build a house, rebuild an engine, etc. He could construct big math theories and write computer code but could not even drive a car. Who was smarter? He made $400K a year at times - but declared bankruptcy twice. I never made more then $30K a year and have always remained solvent. So how do you figure?

I think "smart" depends on how you adapt to the world around you. That is my working definition. Hard to compare the "smarts" of one person's world against another's.

Here's one "case study." I had a friend who came to the USA from Wales. High school drop-out with a Masters electrical license from Massachusetts and his own business. He was depressed all the time with a huge chip on his shoulder -due to his lack of "formal" education." He wanted an official degree so he could claim to be an electrical engineer. So he finally got rid of business, worked for me part-time - and pursued his degrees. As he progressed up the ladder from a HS equiv to a BA, to an MS, etc. he got "dumber" in my opinion. He had to quit working for me. At his own admission - he told me could not just look at something and "figure it out" anymore when in the real world. Too many possibilities and he was crippled by his high level of thought. He went on to run a nuclear power plant for a year. He was more depressed then ever. He told me he felt "worthless." He had a huge income and never got dirty but felt like he never accomplished anything real. Not long after we lost touch. For all I know - he could be back to wiring - or maybe hung himself.
 
Wayne, I don't know about Inteligence but I do know about talking to My best friend. We see each every few years and talk till our jaws are sore. We grew up and our fathers were farmers and we worked hard and when things were slow he and his brothers and me and mine would hunt or have some mechanical project we would work on. Basically we understand each other. Most people I avoid talking to if I can to much trouble to make conversation.
Ron
 
No the two don't equate at all, there is an old saying that someone is ''educated beyond his intelligence'' which aptly applies to many so called educated people. The smartest person I ever knew was my Dad who earned his PHD after WWII and taught Animal Science but he was also a Farmer, Stockman, Cow buyer and the best animal Doctor I have ever known. He could do anything because thats how he grew up and an education was just something he wanted for himself. He always said that a college education could not do much for you that you could not do for yourself if you could read and comprehend what you read.
 
I know a lot of "educated idiots", people with Masters and even one with a Doctorate that haven't the smarts God gave a bee. What they are good at it is taking tests, recognizing the things the test writers are going to want to hit, at "playing the game" and giving the answer the instructor wants no matter what they think the "right" answer is. I imagine most of the test writers are similar people. I know a bunch of other people that don't have much education that can handle a wide variety of things much more smoothly and successfully than the educated guys. I don't know who is "smarter". I don't know that it matters really. A lot of it comes down to opinion I think. If I see someone who takes a completely different thing away from an event than I do, does that make them less intelligent or more intelligent than me? I don't know. What I do know is that in my experience, the more educated a person is, the more rigid their thinking tends to be. They tend to want things to respond to what they believe to be "the way things are", I find them inflexible. I find most tend to be more arrogant the more education they have. They tend not the question their judgement as much as a less educated person might. I use the qualifiers line "tend" and 'might" because there are going to be a lot of exceptions.

One other thing I've noticed is that we tend to think more highly of people who agree with our conclusions, but that put it in more eloquent terms than we might. What that shows, I don't know, but I've rarely met someone who admires the guy who proves them dead wrong and puts it in plain spoken terms. That's diplomacy I suppose, a field where intelligence is so abstract as to be a meaningless term.

In the end, I'm dumber than a rock and have little education beyond high school. The courses I did take were the equivalent of Masters level college courses in law. I did well, maintaining a 3.8 GPA, but that doesn't mean I understood the material so much as I understood what answers I was supposed to put down. Intelligent or trainable? I leave that up to you.
 
I promise to keep this short. I've got loader and blade work to do today.
Intelligence is not just intelligence; it's multiple intelligences. Howard Gardner, Harvard, had his grad asses do research on twenty of the greatest minds. They somewhat surprisingly found 8 distinct intelligences. They expanded the study ten fold and expanded it again. They arrived at 9 distinct intelligences we ALL possess in varying quantities and qualities. These change and develop as we do. The idea of a QUALITY education is to take those intelligences you are stronger at and build and strenghten the less developed. So your education, is like anything else; it is up to the individual person to use that opportunity to develop themselves through their education. If you surround yourself with quality people who work you and build you, you'll come out farther ahead than someone who doesn't.
Getting some breakfast now, gravel's arrived.
Dave
 
We have a lot of intelligent, highly educated, people who don't know anything. When you have an emergency, and call for help, you usually call aperson without a college degree.
 
skilled intelligence Trumps education every time , in my honest opinion , ,,..some of you guys here perhaps have fielded the same of question ,,,did you go to purdue ? , where did you go to college ?...my brother and I consider that question a fine compliment to our barnyard knowledge of everything and all problems thrown at us that we must in this difficult life ..
 
well I would rather be Intellegent than educated because if Im intellegent I am able to figure things out on my own. There are a lot of highly educated people out there who have little common sense,kind of like the old saying Street smart not book smart .Just because a fellow hasnt gotten a degree doesnt mean he isnt self educated. a curious mind and a love for reading will take you far
 
My kids know a lot of people who went to college and have HUGE debt and can only find minimum wage jobs or barely above min. wage.
 
Intelligence beats education hands down. I have a degree in Crop and Soil Science from a major university here in upstate SC. Then retired from there after doing ag research. I am glad I got the education as no one can take that away. I don't use much of what I was educated in and never have, even though I have been in ag almost all my 61 years.
I always wanted to put a banner in the coffee room in my department at Clemson where the profs hung out way to much.
The banner says " An expert in one field is no expert if one field is all he knows".
A lot of people tell me I can make or fix anything. Most of my knowledge came from experience, reading, a group of old timers I hung out with when I was younger and the fact that when I get stumped on something, I stop, stand, stare and give time for the brain to work.
I also ask a lot of questions and appreciate any and all advice whether correct or not.
Richard in NW SC
 
Every person I have ever met was/is ignorant - in some area of life. My cardiologist can"t repair my tractor, change a tire, harvest a crop. In fact, he is almost useless in life. But I did let him operate on my heart in an emergency situation. He did it so well that you would almost think he had common sense!

My brother-in-law, on the other hand, was totally useless when it came to my heart problems. If I had to rely on him, I would have died - his worldly knowledge and common sense wasn"t worth a dime to me at the time. However, he sure was handy to have around in times of mechanical emergencies. Thre wasn"t much that he couln"t diagnose and then fix.

My rambling point is that I try not to judge any individual until I see them in action in their "educated" areas. If they perform adequately, then I give them a pass when they are in other areas of less knowledge.

I, on the other hand, am equally proficient in both - I can"t fix a heart and,truth be known, not much of a mechanic in times of emergency. I guess you could just say I am well-rounded in all areas of life!
 
Some of the stupidest people I have ever met had degrees in Engineering. Not saying ALL engineers are dumb - but quite a few I have run across weren't worth the paper that degree was printed on.
 
First, a disclaimer: I have four college degrees myself, including a Ph.D., and my wife also has four, so I am certainly not about to badmouth education. That said, I can tell you that having worked among Ph.D.s for the past 30 years, some of the best-educated people are dumb as fence posts when it comes to anything beyond their tiny areas of expertise. It takes a certain level of intelligence to reach a certain level of education, of course, but it seems to me that no amount of intelligence and education, singly or combined, can teach common sense. As I said, some of the people with whom I have worked are experts in their field but wouldn't know which end of a hammer to hold to pull a 6-penny nail out of a piece of soft pine.
 
"IQ tests measure your ability to understand ideas and not the quantity of your knowledge, learning new information does not automatically increase your IQ."
High IQ or intelligence is a measure of your ability to learn, to focus on a subject, to rapidly learn. A person with a high IQ will have the ability to focus on a subject to the exclusion of all else. An example: I taught myself Trigonometry in High School. I went through the book in two weeks and tested out. As a young man I had the ability to totally focus on a subject. I was an introvert and had problems carrying on a conversation with others. So you would not have gotten and "intelligent" conversation out of me unless we had very similar interests. you guys now know way to much about me.
 
Education is an easy thing to quantify, describe and evaluate. A degree in Physics pretty much says to know more Physics than the average individual. It doesn't mean you are an expert in optics, relativity, nuclear chemistry or even classical mechanics. But it does give an indication of your level of knowledge.

Intelligence is a bit more difficult to evaluate and quantify. Of course we have had an IQ test around for decades. With all the previous discussions of people of intelligence, I wonder how they would score on an IQ test.

Picture yourself at a 30 year class reunion. In walks classmate A, honor roll student all through high school, two advanced degrees, one from Harvard, the other from the local state university. Easy to see he is educated.

At the same reunion, in walks classmate B, played lots of sports in high school, went to the trade school and worked his way up to repair manager of the local tractor dealership.

And here comes classmate C, class clown, took cooking as a senior, was often in trouble but did pretty well in his classes. He is now selling for a local co-op and doing a great job of providing people with the products they need for their operation, financial ability and personal knowledge. He has an associated degree in both ag and business.

As these individuals mingle with the various groups at the reunion, how will they appear to the various groups? The group in the corner that consisted of football and basketball players. Or the group in the other corner that are all farmers or in a field related to farming? Or the bunch near the door which were former cheerleaders and pom pons? Or lastly, to the bunch near the bar, the former teachers and principal.

Intelligence can change, depending on surroundings, I don't do well around groups that know sports, except for the Cubs. Around trades people, sales persons, repair people, physicists, mathematicians and investment people, I feel pretty comfortable. In each of the scenarios, my education has remained the same but my intelligence has changed as the group changes.
 
How to describe human nature in a few paragraphs?
Intelligence and education , can"t really have one without the other.
I"ve seen some good trades and professional people who worked by rote but did not have any theory or understanding of the task at hand. Once something new or different came along. They were helpless and had no idea what to do.
I would suggest that people have enough education to actually understand what they are doing.
Some people are just unable to understand some things. I know of brilliant musicians that can not change a tire or set a microwave oven clock. I also know people who can set a microwave clock and change a tire who couldn"t carry a tune in a bucket.
The training department here doesn"t ask me more feedback anymore. Seems that remark about" somebody being educated beyond their intelligence " really struck home with a manager.
 
The smartest person I know is my father . He is a mechanical engineer. He came up with a formula to predict output of a 1/2 billion dollar paper machine. He has a plaque with the formula on it. It sort of became a joke among managment because nobody really understood the formula but him. I asked him about that and he said Thats fine if they don't understand it other engineers understand it. Before I knew trig if I wanted to rake a frame on a bike he would tell me the size of the notch to cut . If I needed to make a taper on my lathe he would tell me the math. He has been retired for quite some time.He has given me books I have read like " Principles of Mechanical Design" and other interesting reading. He is not likely smarter than any other engineer but when he is your dad you don't see it that way. He is 86 now and the president of his self run senior complex which I wish he wouldn't do . I think he should relax . But he has been retired for quite some time now. He says it is stressful but he just got re-elected because he didn't want to look like he was wimping out after only one term. My personal conversations are not that intellegent as you can tell by some of my attempts at humor on this site.
 
Intelligence vs education (experience)... they are very different things. Having only one without the other isn't very useful, we need both. Education is just a shortcut to gain experience from others.
 
I believe there are many different types of intelligence as well as many kinds of education. I've always wondered how many people were smart and how many just had a good memory. I've known people who could remember almost anything but if it wasn't memory based they really struggled. I have CRAFT (can't remember a flipping thing) so I have to be able to come up with a different approach than memory.
Some of the smartest people I have worked with have horrible memories but the smart ones with a great memory are the ones that are multi millionaires, mostly self made. These people had some after high school education but not all.
In short, you can't gain an education without some intelligence and you can't use the education without intelligence. Knowledge is just a list of your experiences and we are the sum total of our experience.
 
I find high intelligence in both areas---and also little intelligence in both areas---each person has there nitch in life and you can figure out who to go to for advice
 
All my friends and my wife are intelligent. Some feel they lack education, but myself I just don't have time for dumb people, they are all very smart and grasp things.

Many have high school, or 9 months to 2 years of votech, or college, and then there is a group with 5-7 years of engineering training for computer chip and aeronautics design.

I may be the least educated of the bunch. My high school friends, one wore a pocket protector, really, if that says anything.

It is always fun to be in the middle of thrm and carrying on conversations that are all over the board. Years ago was talking with the aeronautics fella and others, something in the distance looked odd, then changed to a red color, we mused how it must be moving away from us.... And my friend stops, says not many farmers are familiar with the Doppler effect or would get that? We chuckled.

Paul
 
Intelligence and formal education are not synonymous. One of the dumbest guys I ever met had a doctorate.

The world renowned author, Louis L'Amour, quit high school during the first semester of his sophomore year. He said school was interfering with his education. He said why waste an entire semester on, say, general science when you can go to a public library, check out a book on general science that's far more interesting than a high school text book, read and comprehend it in a couple of days, and move on to something else.

The day his high school class graduated, he was in Singapore, a crew member of a merchant ship. I don't think anyone will downplay his intelligence or education.
 
Your friend probably meant that it was nice to have a conversation with someone who agreed with his political views.
 
Intelligence and education are like bread and butter, while they go well together, having one by no means dictates that you have the other.
I consider a person intelligent when they demonstrate an ability to think outside the box, apply there knowledge in ways that you don't see in text books.
Inventors are a good example, they may or may not be educated doesn't really matter, they can think things through and predict an outcome without the aid of a computer program.
Good chess players demonstrate intelligence when they can think ahead and realize the implications of ones actions five or six steps ahead of time.
Many educated people are very talented in one specific field, yet are unable to for example change a tire on a car, is this a measure of how intelligent they are, no of course not.
Now if they can apply some of there knowledge and weigh the probable results of there actions in short order an inteligent person will soon be rolling down the road again.
I know people who have spent many years in university and I know some who can't spell at a grade five level.
The intelligent ones that became successful in business and life came from both categories, but so did the failures.
 
College education has its place just as everything else, but Im sure most of you know the one guy who "thinks" he knows everything....I have relatives that way. As I told a friend of mine....pertaining to people who just went to vo-tech (as I did, for Farm Diesel) rather than college...mechanical smart you know something, college smart you "think" you know something.
 
You're right, intelligence is relative to its environment and those with whom it interacts.
Also, just as in your scenario, success or "value" is relative to those evaluating it.
 
I don't believe that education and intelligence are at all equal. I have no more than an associate's degree in anything, but at work the plant manager always wants my opinion, sometimes before consulting the engineering department. As I said, I have some education, but most of my knowledge has been self-inflicted.
 
I believe it is entirely aptitude and attitude, college teaches you methods to research and problem solve. A degree shows a commitment to finishing something.
 
Congratulations, NCWayne! This topic has generated some really good and valuable observations and comments. Not a bad post in the bunch.
 
As for myself I walked away from high school in my senior year as I was that bored with what I was being taught. (I went back 10 yrs later and got my GED and was in the top 7% in NYS) My interests are TOO vast. I am a jack at many trades, master of nothing. I can proof read however I can't spell (as you can tell if you read this post).
It's not what I know, it's who I know that knows what I need to know.
I come here to learn so that puts many/most of you on the list of smartest poeple I know and I thank each and every one of you for giving that help to each and every one of us that don't know!!

I know/ have known so many intellegent/ smart people in my 54 yrs that I dont know where to start or stop.

My FIL is probably at the top of the list. I don't know his formal education level but when he joined the navy during WW2 he wasn't allowed to fight as his older brother already was doing that. Instead he was taught how to build a ship from keel to antena. He built his current home with help from his family and friends. From designing it to the final finishing nail he did it. Today, at 88, he can't see or hear well enough to do things around his home.

My Dad ties my FIL. My Dad was, and always will be, the smartest man I have ever been blessed with knowing. He could do math faster in his head than I could with a adding machine. He ran a grader for NYSDOT for most of my life. He was the last "crane and shovel" operator in NYSDOT during the 80s. He was a Korean Vet and all I can say about his 'specalty' is that as kids we weren't allowed to wear he old uniform shirts till he removed the arm patch and didn't get his DD-214 till he was 65.
He had a saying that I have trouble living by: Poeple will be poeple!
His formal education was a high school diploma.

My Mom was/is a very smart lady that in her advancing yrs isn't using her commom sense as much as she used to. She worked at Syracuse University for 30 yrs as a head secratay for undergrads. She guided many through the maze of classes to get the right courses. Just think how many 'educated beyond intellegence' she worked with LOL. Sitting in her office one time I met a young man that was a Prince and then his father 'The King' of a small country in the mideast During her last illness whe received cards from around the world

A local farmer's obit would have been shorter had they posted what he didn't know. I found out later that top educators from places like Cornell would contact him with questions.
He once gave my SWMBO the compliment of how good she was doing with pasture managment for the horses. I didn't realize how high of praise that was till we read his obit.

In closing, I have been blessed with meeting many, many smart and intellegent people in my life time.
 
Used to seem to be true around here in fly over land. (Those that can Do, Those that can't Teach)

Very few living on a farm back in the 50's in my area went to collage. Had very little to do with intelligence. Not an intelligent conversation to question why.
 
It all depends on where you look for intellectual stimulation LOL!! Personally, I have a MS in wildlife management, which was necessary to pursue my career as a Wildlife Biologist (now retired). However, I can and do find equal comfort in hanging with folks with or without a degree. I fully agree that college does not teach common sense nor the ability to discern right from wrong. I have known in my life folks with a college degree that seem to constantly get in their own way, and I have known folks with little formal education who are brilliant. I hold anyone in high regard whom is self taught.
 
I think you are certainly right about this one. I have worked with the full scale. As others have said I think it boils down to common sense (a very subjective term according to some) and or pragmatism. 'If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck', it is surprising the number of people out there who insist it is a peacock.
 
This has many facets, everyone is different, and unique, prior to formal education or beginning a career. Some are naturally talented, naturally intelligent or have characteristics that compliment their being, or relate to what they do.

Sure, I know business owners that are successful, barely got out of high school, but could not re-spool a string trimmer or could use a paint brush, or do anything vocational, perform any kind of trade, would have trouble reading a tape measure or laying something out.

I know some business owners that would realize many benefits from a college education, higher learning, or some formal education or training, just plain ignorant. I have attended college with some who saw the necessity of the formal education to further their career, business, better themselves, and did benefit from both practical experience and formal education and or training.

I have a long time friend in the HVAC, M.E.P. field, with a lot of training, some college, but very practical, efficient and extremely good at what he does, could work for any outfit he wanted, literally. This same person does not like doing jobs for people that have highly technical backgrounds in many kinds of professions as they always seem to exhibit a high degree of scrutiny, so detail orientated, so focused on over thinking things, questioning everything, trying to re-invent the wheel, often times interrupting the continuity of his work. Now, not all, but he does have many of these kinds of customers, who are still polite for the most part, some can be rude or inconsiderate, and many stand over his shoulder for too long. Now, please don't any folks take offense, I'm just describing experiences, I've been on jobs with him, I've seen the differences in people in general, maybe it has to do with their profession, maybe its just how they are, so in general, some customers or people can be highly intellectual, technical, but not practical, that's probably a safer way to put it. He's also had customers that have the same technical or highly educated background, but are practical, don't stand over your shoulder, so it really boils down to people and their unique characteristics, than it does what they do. He does remember those who are a bit much, and tries to avoid doing work for them if possible, finding it annoying. Again, just describing based on observation, I'm no better than the next guy, humble enough to realize no matter how different we are from each other, aside from criminals and the dregs of society in that element of people, we're all the same in many ways and no one is any better than the next.

I am a college grad, but I have a practical sense, I think its a great combination, and I am good at many trades, but have a good perception of technical things relative to my career or background. I think its desirable to pursue both, if you can, it may not be for everyone. Some people are naturally gifted be it intelligence, practicality, athletically, physically, some are great with poise, patience, and do well under pressure, others can absorb and understand the most technological things out there, math science, chemistry, physics, others can write and communicate to the same level.

When you think about it, doesn't this forum have a diverse group of participants that cover the spectrum of this subject ?

One thing is for sure, don't try and figure it out, its one those things, just go with the flow and enjoy the company of a diverse group of people from all walks of life.
 
I know a lot of people with a college education that are not intelligent nor do they have any common sense.

The guy next door is a mechanical engineer - and he works as a maintence man for a restaurant chain in the state. Plus he suffers from that dread disease spelled L-A-Z-Y!

I have a B.S. degree plus 2 minors to round out my education. I actually used my minors in my career as much as I used my B.S. degree.
 
To me, "intelligence" is the ability to think and to learn. "Education" is the mental storing of facts. "Wisdom" is the ability to know what to do with both. Mike
 
While visiting with friends- one of whom is our next door neighbor- our neighbor said "I hadn't heard about that" (what we were discussing). One of us said "we heard about it on Fox News". Neighbor (who has cable) said he NEVER watches Fox news. Many people don't know the facts (ignorant).. by choice.
 
Education is the collection of facts. Intelligence is knowing how to apply them.

One the other hand,
The difference between ignorance and stupidity? Ignorance is temporary.
 
There truly is a difference between education and intelligence. Unfortunately the gap between intelligence and education will continue to get worse as the nightmare called Common Core is implemented.
 

No they are not.

I've dealt with educated people who know nothing and uneducated people who know everything.

I'd sooner deal with someone who knows what they are doing whether they have a piece of paper or not.

Depends on the context.
 
Very interesting post. I will think of this as I attend my 50th anniversary of HS.At the very least will see how much everybody has done in 50 years. joe
 
Intelligence dictates how much of an education, either by doing or by schooling a person can get. Then you have to add in common sense which isn't so common. I've known people with college degrees who couldn't hold a conversation and lacked common sense. I've known high school drop out who were pretty darn intelligent with a lot of common sense. Kinda hard to pigeon hole people based on their education level or IQ.

Rick
 
Intelligence is the God given ability to receive , process and apply an education in any subject matter.
 
Believe it or not we didn't discuss anything political. In fact I only remember politics coming up when he said that since he let his hair grow out a little, some of the folks he associates with when selling the rustic items he makes turning and carving wood, think he leans to the left, when it fact he doesn't.
 
I have heard them called "educated idiots" by my Dad all my life. He said he heard it all his life from his Grandma. Funny there are still so many of them around.......LOL
 
My last day of school was my best. But I do remember something that our principal said. While holding up a piece of paper like it was a diploma, "that diploma wouldn't do you a bit of good if you don't have any common sense." How very true, as others have said!
 
I have BS in Mechanical Engineering, and I'm also a Journeyman Tool & Die Maker and a Master Electrician. I don't think I'm qualified to comment on the difference between intelligence and education, but I can say that it's work that gets the job done. It doesn't matter how much education a person has, or how intelligent they are, if they don't apply it through work NOTHING will happen.
 
How can a dyed in the wool nnalert apparatchick comment in an intelligence thread?
 
Been retired for 10 years. The thing I miss the most about working, is having an intellegent conversation. So one day a person asked if I was talking to myself? I told them no, I was listening to an intellegent conversation.
 
Intellegence is the ability to think.
Education should teach you how to use your natural intellegence to think better and give you some tools to use in the process...like math skills.Most specific education becomes less relevant as time passes and the science of the field changes. I no longer use my slide rule from college.
Some education is so specific that it has little relevance to daily living, like Nuclear Physics, while other education is useful daily , like reading and writing skills
for the rest of your life.
Creativity is a different thing all together. Many smart and educated people have zero creativity. Most inventors have lots of creativity.
But, those drugs that keep us alive and the vaccines that stopped polio were not invented by uneducated geniuses.
Being smart is important but having the education to use it is a major component of the process.
 
Many people watch a specific news channel to tell them what they think.
If they hear both sides of the argument it confuses them.
Thinking is hard work....and many people avoid it.
 
(quoted from post at 19:17:26 06/08/14) Your total distain for the opinions of others fits better into a into a
dictatorship than a democracy.
Click to expand...

Its ironic how you posted your distain of HIS opinion...

Its always wonderful when the rabid left wingers always preach tolerance yet at the same time, are intolerant themselves. Tolerance is only accepted by the fanatical left when it aligns with their views....

Its always wonderful when the radical left starts throwing around "democracy" and "dictatorship". When the right does something that the left dont agree with, its "ramed through like a dictatorship". When the left does something, its the American way... true democracy...

I could go on and on but Im awaiting Edd in KY to make up more lies on the unemployment rates around 2008 so I think I will quick grab the bookmarks I have and be ready for his responce... he has gotten at least 5 threads poofed so far so I want to be ready....
 
I am an old guy, I belonged to the John Birch Society (true conservatives), likey before you were born. Voted GOP all my life, written some big checks to the party. But I don't like pols that put career ahead of country or business ahead of the people.
The policies of certain people have crippled the ability of our industries to compete in our own country. Sure, do you think all our businesses are run by idiots? steel, textiles,clothing, appliances, electronics, automobiles???
Who has prospered? Government, Medical and education. It did not start 6 years ago, it has been going on for 30 years....right thru red and blue alike.

Too much corruption and hanky panky. We have become a third world nation full of graft and insider deals.
 
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