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WT? Anyone seen this?

J

JF in MI

Well-known Member
I am really PO'ed here. Planned on starting my spring wood splitting for next year's heating season. My tractor runs the wood splitter. Went out this morning to plug in the 'Five Star Mfg' block heater on the tractor (the type that goes into the freeze out plug hole) and it kept popping the ground fault interrupter. Checked it with an ohm meter and the resistance between the spades and ground pin is half that between the spades. IT'S ONLY 4 OR 5 YEARS OLD! Now it'll be a real pain to get started if at all. Is this the typical life I can expect out of one of those heaters? I am major bummed!

Jim
 
Kinda like fence chargers.

I (and everyone I know) seem to be going through them like they were intended to be disposable.
 
I,ve had two of them burn the cords off in the last year. One on my two year old 7230 Deere, almost burnt the tractor. Makes me scared to even plug them in any more especially when they are in a shed.
 
how cold are your overnite temps? i gave up on block heaters they only work when you dont need them, when its cold my john deere diesel aint going to start on its own, but ive found if i drape the hood with a tarp big enough to go to the ground then put one of those shiny round metal flood lites under there with a 6ow bulb,overnight the thing will fire up like it was just driven
 
I have very goodluck with frost plug heaters, one thing I found with my custoers that were having problems is that they started the engines with the heaters still plugged in, bubbles in the coolant when running stick to the element and cause them to fail,,, may not be your problem just a thought, one other thing is you need a correct mix of antifreeze also cnt
 
I have seen block heaters that trip a GFI outlet work on a regular outlet. If you're getting a reading between the two spade lugs, that means it's good yet. If you get a reading between a spade lug and the ground lug means the heating element is touching some where internally and won't heat effectively.
 
I've never had a welsh plug heater go bad on me. While working as a mechanic we had a guy bring in his truck with a bad one. Found out talking to him he had installed it himself, failed to follow the instructions and plugged it in without first putting the coolant back in "just long enough to make sure it worked".

I always unplug em before starting.

Rick
 
As you found, theres the normal resistance between the Hot and Neutral (A GrounDED Conductor) that's the continuous path that produces resistance heat butttttttttttt there shouldn't be a current path from EITHER conductor to the case/frame cuz that means there's a shorting current conducting path and if its as low as around 5 milliamps the GFCI does its job and trips, that's NOT a bad GFCI that's a GOOD GFCI doing its job to save a life or prevent a fire.

Now, ifffffff the heater is equipped with the third wire safety Ground (A GroundING Conductor) which is then effectively wired to the engines case/frame and the coolant in which the heater is immersed somehow (short or leak etc) were to allow 5 milliamps of return current to flow OTHER THEN VIA THE NEUTRAL that again trips the good working GFCI....

SOOOOOOOO as you have discovered any leaks or shorts in a defective heating unit is gonna trip the GFCI grrrrrrrrrrrrr Ive been there n done that, hard to find a good quality long lasting unit.

I as a retired electrical engineer just cant in good faith and conscience recommend cutting off third wire GroundING circuits even in cases where such may or may not (depends on circumstances) allow a device to work, but its your tractor your life and your choice so keep safe best wishes God Bless and good luck.......

Ol John T and all
 
What if the heater is shorted to the engine and you cut the ground prong off. Some one plugs it into a non groundfault plug and someones child touches the tractor??? DH
 
The guy just wanted to split wood today and get the tractor started. As someone else posted it may work in a regular receptacle. Worse case it teaches the kid not to touch stuff.
 
The mission is to start the tractor and split wood all else secondary to the mission is irrelevent. Worse case the kid gets eletrocuted -now do you feel better. If the unit worked in the GFI and the kid recieved current the GFI would trip.
 
A GFI will work without grounding. In an older home where a receptacle has no ground path back to the panel the answer is to install a GFI.
 
If the heater"s bad and if it"s easily accessible you can replace it without draining the coolant if you have your ducks in a row ahead of time. One safety rule with a freeze plug heater is to keep the area around it clean so nothing can catch fire if the wire burns off. Jim
 
If it has a replaceable cord check that end. Probably burnt the pins off. Had to replace one on the loader a few months ago. Seems like they last about three years and then the element burns out.
 
I very rarely have trouble with a in the block heater. I would check the cord if it is removable. The JD heaters have the cord plug into the heater. They can go bad at that plug.

If you want to go today you can heat it up some other way. If you have a space heater. Just point it at the tractor and put a wind block on the other side, card board, sheet of plywood,etc.

I have even used a steel hog feed pan and charcoal to heat them up if there is no electric around. Once even used a piece of metal roofing with charcoal on the top to heat one up. just have the charcoal under the engine pan and the raising heat will warm the motor up.

Unless you are super cold just a little heat should get the tractor to go.
 
I would n't put a fire under any tractor. Grandfather burnt his 9N up when the sediment bowl broke from a fire under the engine.
 
Follow up;
I managed to get it going with the Thermostart alone (phew!). The heater is one that I would have to drain the coolant again to replace. Reading some of the responses here I'm reconsidering replacing it in favor of some kind of simpler external method. We'll see.

Jim
 
THE HEATER IS FAULTY.IT WILL CONNECT THE AC LINE to the tractor body.That can electrocute any one who touches the tractor.This happens often in water heaters and inblock heaters.Ground pin is there for a good reason.Anyone who cuts a ground pin off is an IDIOT.
 
Not a help fpr ypur tractor, but I got a tractor which had a corroded connector on the unit, no cord. Replaced it with a new one, found a plastic pipe cap that screwed right over the unit"s connector. So when not in use cord is removed, stored in a safe place and the heater covered, protected form corrosion.
 
When I have the coolant out, I replace the block heater, and install a LR hose heater, as a backup. I think the last BH on my loader lasted about 5-6 years. Make sure you install the BH with the loop in the position described in the instructions, sometimes, by rotating the loop, you hit a cyl liner,or part of the water jacket, and any contact with the loop, by any other metal, leads to failure of the loop, at that point.
 
No one has mentioned this, but you guys who are getting short lives from your block heaters aren't starting the engine with the heater plugged in are you? That's the fastest way to burn out the element.
 
If the original poster left it plugged into the GFI he could possibly start the tractor and get his wood cut. The purpose of these forums is to help someone get something done. I did not mean for it to be anything more than a try at getting the heater to make heat and get his job done after he starts his tractor he can throw the heater in the garbage. I was not suggesting it not remain plugged anywhere but the GFI. You and the other clown did not help any way just waste time arguing with my idea to help a man get to his task.
 
I live in northeast Ohio,have a Ford diesel and have not used the heater in 15 years and I use the tractor nearly every day either putting in round bales or moving snow and have never had a problem with it starting.
 
Block heaters are standard winter equpment here in Sask. You don't start a diesel without a working heater. I have had good luck with both types. I do recall replacing the frost plug type heater in my 2090 Case many years ago but couldn't even say how long ago. And I start it up first , then unplug the heater with no apparent harm. The other older tractors have the external tank type heaters. 1500 watts on those small cooling systems will have them ready to run like summer time in under an hour even in our cold Sask. weather.
The space heater method works too. My old 730 Case has no heater so on the rare occasion I need to start it in the cold weather I will set up the space heater with about a ten foot piece of pipe between the heater and the manifold side of the engine. Works great.
 
Far from a clown.Ive spent years in appliance service and know what can happen when heating elements burn a hole in the sheath and energize the water.You dont know nothing about the subject, worse you dont suspect nuthin.Your posts can get some one killed if they do what you say.
 
JF, if you want some straight answers on faulty electric heat elements I will try to answer your questions and the question of other posters on this forum..Your heater is BAD if you get any ohms reading from the ground pin to the heater element.
 
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