OT: Answering people who want time estimates for work.

I work at a large organization and I must occasionally deal with a very type 'A' (and influential) boss from another department wanting time estimates for huge projects -- projects taking many months and very difficult to predict what problems will be encountered along the way. I'm already giving 110% and having him ask for deadlines seems like a slap in the face. In 2011, I gave up over 200 hours of use-it-or-lose-it vacation in order to make sure I would meet one of his previous deadlines. In 2012 I lost over 90 hours. I insisted on taking some vacation because I had to fix on my house. I should mention that he and his subordinates always make a great effort to use up every bit of their vacation every year.

If all I had to worry about was his projects, it wouldn't too much of a problem, but I have many other people who rely on me to help them when things go wrong or when they need something.

Apparently he believes that he must ride people for deadlines or nothing will get done. This is simply not the case and I achieved great things before he ever came along. I assumed the responsibilities of 5-6 people who left the organization and there was a huge savings by not having to refill their positions. I have done many other things which have cumulatively saved several million dollars over the years. They have also made me supervisor of a couple of people (something I really didn't want) and keeping them busy and checking their work is another thing for me to do.

Anyway, I know there is a lot of combined wisdom and many of you have worked with difficult bosses. What can I say to him that will let him know that I always have the interests of the organization in mind and I'm already giving 110% without sounding like a whiny little putz ? I've never had to remind people I'm doing well and I've always received generous raises and invitations to come back on all previous jobs (20 plus years ago). This place is so big and there are so many attitudes and personalities to deal with it can be frustrating at times. I would just like to hear some ideas from some of you.

You said he's from another department. Have you talked to the boss of the department you work for?

Been there / done that! First thing is you will NOT change him so don't waste your time trying. Second thing is , and more importantly , DON'T let him change you. I have always said " If the only complaint they have is how long a project took me , I will shake their hand and thank them ". The only power he has over you is the power YOU give him! A type "A" will never be happy , if you get it done on time it won't be good enough and if it is perfect he will complain it took too long. It is HIS problem so let it be his problem. I'm living proof that it works. In most larger companies you have only two choices , you can either be an @ss hole or a door mat , there is no in between.

Take your vacation time. That is part of what you contracted for in your job.

Tell him and any others who think you should not take it that his lack of planning is not considered an emergency for you.

My Dad had a horse that was a type A when crossing the creek. A heavy quirt between the eyes one time cured that problem. Your clown needs the same. Type A's are the way they are because they never were told to tamp sand.

Go to your department boss, explain you would like to help this guy, but your first priority is to your department,,,,,,, let him take it from there. Otherwise politely explain you have given up lots of precious vacation time in past and are not able to continue to do so, firmly. Some people feel the world revolves around them, if so, he still wont get it!

Our Daughter is in the same position you are. She workes for a major comunications company and the division she works in develops and installs custom comunication systems for large companies. An individual much like you described was made manager of the group that she works in. About a week ago the Brass called a meeting, to brain storm a bit. All people involved were there. The Brass asked what needed to be done to keep things running smoothly. A few coworkers offered some ideas that the manager ignored, in the past. Finally our daughter decided to tell the Brass that the lazy no good manager had to go, as moral was at an all time low and he would not accept any of the coworkers sugestions. Her coworkers stood up and aplauded her, because she had the nerve to say what they all were thinking, but didn't dare say. The Brass said that they would respond by the end of the month. She is still putting in 50 to 60 hrs per week and salaried, She and her coworkers, most on the clock, receive bonuses for ontime projects with no glitches, but those also shrank with the new manager.
Loren, the Acg.

I agree with the others. You won't change him. Take your vacation time, or if you give it up demand to be compensated.
My father in law thought the company he worked for wouldn't survive if he took his vacation. He ended up losing over 2 years of paid vacation.

Does the department head need the time estimate for scheduling in his department?
Are you required to give him the estimate?
Do you have a department head that should be dealing with this instead of you?

If you absolutely have to give the time estimate figure how long it will take if everything goes well. Add 15-20%. Add in time for all of your other duties. Don't forget to include your vacation time.
When you give him the estimate make it very clear the estimate is a baseline and anything unexpected that pops up will add to the duration of the project. The 15-20% should cover allot of that but don't tell him that.
Also make it very clear to him that having to do these time estimates just puts you farther behind.

Used to have somewhat the same problem from one of my previous bosses. He'd come in with a new project for me and the guys I worked with, and want to know when we could get it done. Answer: "Which one of your other projects that we're working on do you want us to stop to do this one?". Usually the answer was a blank stare. Time is a finite thing, got to set priorities and then the goals will fall in line. At least until the next new project rolls along.

not your dept boss? tell your immediate the issue- take your time off it"s yours ,you earned it---if it pesists tactfully figure out how to tell him to pound sand.

Russel AZ said it right, tell him to go pack sand! Someone else said it also he will walk all over you if you let him. I made the mistake you are in the middle of, but I didn't do the right thing, tried going to the boss but he didn't want to hear it. Tell this guy where to go at every reasonable opportunity and don't be shy about it.

I like type A people they are so easy to trip up, do it with your estimates.

Type As can get things done but will run over anyone to do it. They think of no one but themselves and are prone to throwing hissy fits and blowing their top when they don't get their way.
You have to give them boundaries when it comes to your time, your space, your opinions or just anything thats yours. Once he knows you won't bend to him and will stand your ground, he won't push you anymore. Basically, he won't respect you until you do.
Question? Would he help you get a promotion, even if you ran the whole company single-handedly? I'll bet the answer is no, because he'll never see you as an equal and DOESN'T WANT YOU TO BE. Your just his b!tch and thats what calms his insecurities.
I may be a bit harsh and/or off the beaten path on this but I've dealt with type As before and it sounds like he fits the mold.

Your own boss will ultimately sets your priorities. I would take 10 minutes to talk the situation over with your direct boss before taking any action. Bring along a copy of the secification, a rough (2 minute estimate) order of magnitue for the project's total costs and timelines, and bring an estimated range of how many hours it will take for you to write-up the quote to satifaction. Your boss is more aware of what's going on upstairs than you are and will tell you if the new quotes are a priority or not, and if he wants it included in your work load.

Does your group have a formal "Request for Quote" procedure that goes through your boss? Sometimes frequent and time consuming quotes get billed to the requestor as a "Paid Quote".

Here is what I do.
If the "boss" or engineer or important person wants a deadline estimate, you always pad it up 25% or more.

You might ask your immediate boss how to deal with this guy. What I do when I'm bidding a large job I think will take 6 months, I tell my customers the job will take 6 to 8 months. Something nearly always goes wrong and makes the job take longer.

I worked for a large corporation for years. I think you should be careful, but you need to do something. 2 things I'd like to point out:

1) Your job is to do these estimates. You have a boss. You need to take care of him first.

2) I suspect that his ability to get you to do these jobs, on your own time really, is making him "influential". You are really doing part of his work, and his department is not paying for it.

3) You need to unwind this carefully. You should have never got yourself into this situation.

4) I'd go to your boss, and ask about OT. And mention the lack of vacation. They aren't going to give you the OT. But they will make sure that you take your vacation, and your boss will have to start doing his job, managing your workload.

5) Start looking for another job. Not that you have to change, but be ready, and get your mind ready for it.

6) Good luck.

Go ahead and take your vacation, all your work will still be waiting for you to get back !!
That's how it seems everywhere I have been. This ecomomy is so bad, hard to find another place to go too.

It's hard to anmswer your question without knowing who works for who. Does your boss report to the "problem" executive? If that is the case, start looking for a new job. If not, you really need to tell your boss the problem executive is poaching because your work for the other guy is cutting into your boss's performance. Watch the movie "Office Space" for a good explanation of illogical corporate structure.

dead right.

stop.

Sorry - you are on a tractor board and your boss isn't, so I'd like to take your side... BUT...

I've made a good living fixing dysfunctional work groups. I've seen it all.

Your sending up a big red flag to me by saying you don't like to schedule your projects... AND you're wondering why you don't get your vacation time.

You have to look at yourself - not your boss. YOU have to get more type A in you.

If you want to work in a business world, you've got to adapt to it, not the other way around.

Free and loose works great when you're a creative genius, top level programmer at microsoft. But assuming that's not the case (no offense intended) you've got to embrace the power of documentation.

Have a plan.

Take some project management courses.

You'll find there are good ways to manage projects that are flexible. Get better at estimating and anticipating typical changes.

You'll see the light once you get good at it.

You're not getting your vacation time because you're not managing your time properly.

If your boss were doing your job, I'd guarantee he'd find a way to schedule his vacation time - I don't even know the guy, but I know I'm right.

Ask yourself why your boss is in his position and you're not.

If your answer is along the lines of "because he lies and he knows this or that person - and he shouldn't have the job because he's stupid" you're not a very upwardly mobile person.

If your answer is more like "he has a degree in X and is good at Y, speaks well, gives good presentations, etc..." it's more likely you're the type that will succeed in the business world.

If you're the first type - don't be.

Document everything you told us and more . Download info such as emails that prove you we"re are work and the projects at hand. Keep info at home .
Cranky manager will do his best to shoot the messenger (you) instead of admitting fault.
As for estimates. Take into consideration, allow for anything and everything to go wrong. Then double the cost and time.