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OT/fighting city hall

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Nancy Howell

Well-known Member
The county tax appraisal on the house at the farm was jumped from $86,00 to $136,000. James is meeting with them this morning at 11:00 to dispute the huge increase in valuation. The house is 48 yrs old, never been updated. I typed up a 3 page, 30 pt. list of the issues for him to take to the county tax assessor.

For those that are inclined, prayer cover is requested. The house is not worth $136,000, but getting city hall to change, well, we all know what that's like.
 
Good luck Nancy. I had that fight about 6 years ago with Randolph County, IN on my 1864 farmhouse. I had it professionally appraised than appealed it and won. The appraisal cost $500 but that is how much my property taxes were reduced on an annual basis.
 
Best of luck to you!!! I hear a lot of horror stories, but my own experience was nothing but positive. When my dad passed away and I became my moms guardian and executor of his estate one of the first things that struck me was that the actual tax bill was alomst 25% of the gross farm income. I took that, the tax returns, and some other things to the county property valuation administrators office. Got to meet with the acutal PVA within just minutes. He agreed that the amount was excessive and determined that the tax bills from multiple purchases over multiple years should have been combined. When he did, it dropped the actual amount of tax by 75%. Still high, but the house is based on age and square footage, cant do much about that. Im pleased, thought he was fair and professional.
 
Good luck Nancy. It could be just a fishing expedition on their part. They jumped ours by 700% a few years ago, and I met with them and calmly argued my side with the end result being the taxes were lowered to a level that was less than what they were in the beginning. I used the word "calmly" - some of my friends did not argue calmly, and the results were not positive, in fact, the police were called in one instance because the folks in the office were "fearful" of my friend's behavior. When I was there, I felt that the people that I dealt with in the tax office were purposly baiting me to make me lose my cool, but I've been in arguments with meaner people than that and I didn't take the bait.

The first thing that they will ask you for is a copy of the insurance policy on the house. Sometimes that in itself is enough to make a person turn tail, but your arguement can be that the policy is for the cost of replacing the structure, NOT what you think it's worth.

I told them to feel free to raise my taxes every time they raise Social Security, and for the same percentage, and they'll never hear a complaint from me.

They just rolled their eyes. . .

I think real estate taxes should be abolished and made into an income tax. That way, the home you worked hard for all your life would still be affordable when you retire. And it would be predictable. Plus - if the economy goes south, the county is forced to bite the bullet too. You can move out of the county, but they don't care because they know the house ain't going anywhere.

The present system is left over from when you'd trade a live chicken for a sack of beans.
 
My Grandmothers old Victorian house was not livable. Broken windows, coons living in it. This was in the late 70's. It had been vacant for 15 years. Tax people raised it assessment. Said it was a "modern, livable house" They had only driven by it and viewed it from the highway, a quarter of a mile away.

So we tore it down.

Gene
 
Deal with them calmly and with a degree of professionalism, have reasons other than emotion or your opinion as to why the appraisal is wrong. Any appraisals or information on comparable sales could be helpful. Ask them HOW or what basis they used to come to this estimate of value, that may make them a little defensive but if they made wrong assumptions they'll can back up some and it's not as big of an affront to them. There are various ways they adjust your appraisal, but the bottom line is they don't actually value your property individually, they make en-mass adjustments based upon samples of the district. Although up here in the people's republic of Wisconsin some times the appraisal adjustments are based more on how much they have to increase the tax roll to meet their budget with out changing the millage, that way the politicians can use the phrase "didn't raise taxes" in their re-election efforts.
 
I have to work and James is going by himself. Meeting was to start at 11:00. On pins and needles waiting to hear from him how it went.

They also dropped the ag exemptions off all of our property and dropped the homestead exemption off the house. Don't know how that happened, since James and I paid the taxes in person last December and specifically requested the homestead exemption on the house.

We did not get a real estate appraisal prior to today's meeting. If the meeting does not go well, we'll get an appraisal, go back and try again.

I'll let ya'll know what happens.
 
I looked into the process for a client once. Here, they base it on comparable sales- and one guy paid too much for a house, so they used that single "comp sale" on every property within 5 miles. I came up with 3 that were closer to the subject property than the one they were using, and more recent. They did make an appropriate adjustment.
 
the old saying "YOU CAN'T FIGHT CITY HALL" i hope you win, tired of the gov giving the shaft to the little people... need the new saying, "YOU CAN FIGHT CITY HALL AND WIN"
 
You should probably do some research first. {a bit late now] If an assesment was made by an outside agency then it is assumed to be correct.In my area a guy comes to each home and I had to let him in. He got to the basement and was staring at my upright compressor . I asked him what was the matter . He said Im trying to figure out what kind of hot water heater this is. Oh oh. It's the white thing over there this is a compressor ! { it is painted black]. Then they will count bathroom vents to see if any bathrooms were added . [He is also trying to see if I changed hot water heaters witout a permit ,which I did ] . Just going and asking for a reduction is not good enough. You need something they didn't take into consideration such as you are envoirmentaLLY sensitive zoned etc. They have an office filled with people complaining about the increase all day long and you are just one of many. Any ads for a lawyer to help are not needed but you need a reason the assesment is wrong in most cases. Quoting market prices in the area is not a reason if each home was assesed individually. I only know what will fly in my area.
 
Nancy . Hate to be the bearer of bad news buttttttttt "YOU CANT BEAT CITY HALL" unless you have a friend sitting on the board, and even then they in turn have to buddy up to your pal. They'll minutely lower the tax so you'll quit complaining.UNFAIR? you bet it is. Lots of luck,and watch next years taxes increase on your property.Time for them to spread your wealth around,property owners are the first to have their billfold opened,before they'll even find other ways to cut back gov expenditures.
LOU
 
To our knowledge, no one has been out to look at the property. It will be interesting to find out what they used to raise the appraisal value by $50,000.

I sent a long list with James detailing issues with the house, including saying it would probably fail a mechanical inspection because of the heating/AC and plumbing.

We'll see what happens.
 
I know of taxes being doubled on a common farm home just because the owners carpeted one or two rooms. The tax assor never set foot in the house , just looked in a window when the owners were gone. They appealed , result was higher assetment the following yr. This was in Mo.
 
The Tax Assessor must have recently been re-elected and is hoping everyone will forget who raised the rates in four years or lost an election and is taking revenge.
 
No property has sold in our area for years. The area is very rural and houses vary widely in size and quality.

The closest thing to a "sale" was about 4 yrs ago. Our neighbor (1/2 mile away by road) gave a small piece (maybe 1/2 acre) to his daughter. She built a nice new home on it. Don't know if they're using that as a comp.
 
Nancy, you and James are probably more adept at fighting city hall than the average Joe because your professions require documentation and communication skills. If you can't do it, nobody can. Good luck and let us know how it turns out. Jim
 
You answered your own question Nancy.Ag exp.and homestead exp.If you do not live in your home 100% of the time,then you can not claim the Homestead part.You do live in two different houses,city &Farm.
 
Hi Nancy,Check and see how much other neighbor's tax have increased (including the appraiser) Is property in your area selling at well above appraisal. Earl
 
They did that to me in Mi a few years ago, The board of review couldnt help me so I went to the Tax Tribunal and told my side and he dropped it back to where it was and set it for the next 3 years. But you have to go to the board of review first. Good luck to James
 
You'll do better if you have a 3 house comparison appraisal to present to the appraisal board. This is where use have appraisal of 3 similar houses done by a license appraiser. Yes it not cheap but I've had better luck doing it this way when contesting an appraisal.
 
A few years back, I had a similar jump in my assessment. The good news was, I had a recent appraisal from when I refinanced my mortgage, so I sent a copy of that to the assessor. He sent me the proper appeal form, and I sent another copy of the appraisal with that...and won my case.

Good luck!
 
Back in the early '90s, I owned some land (with no house) in Lucas, Texas. My appraisal nearly doubled one year. I scheduled an appointment with the appraiser and he agreed that the value was too high. He lowered it back to what it was the previous year.
 
I think its well worth doing, I did a similar thing here on the house, I forget the reduction, don't have the file in front of me, but with something like this I cannot see any other alternative then to dispute and firmly represent ones self and "getting in someones face" about it.

The situation with taxation in the U.S. is rapidly becoming intolerable and frightening for many, I could sit here and say this or that about local, state and federal government, personally, maybe I'd just not educated enough as to why decent working people have to be burdened so heavily at every level so government can be funded and undeniable hard to dispute as to the amount, and their accountability as to what they do. Some of us are more successful than others, and can stay in the poker game when the pot is raised drastically, but masses of others for all kinds of reasons and situations have to endure hardship after working all their lives and contributing, yet the government hand just keeps reaching for more.

Ironically, what if we burnt all our houses down, pitched tents and said, " Assess this you pompous @ss! LOL !!!!!!!!!! well, that gives me a chuckle just thinking about it, better quite while I am ahead, and best of luck to you guys,
 
The Dukabors tried that in Canada . They used to burn their house down . Only thing is you have to be naked when you do it. It was not a pretty sight. The book about it was called "Terror in the Name of God" . Lots of color pics too.
 
Talk directly to the Assessor if you can. He/she is the politician and can be subject to some wheedling from a constituent, particularly if you are well-known and respected in the community. The investigations, reports and calculations that resulted in your increased assessment were made by lackeys in the assessor's office. The Assessor can with the stroke of a pen change the particulars in your favor, as the assessment guidelines he/she has to follow are flexible.

Does Texas have a policy whereby assessments can be frozen forever when you reach a certain age? You need to know.
 
Terror in the Name of God -Sons of Freedom Doukhabors. They were a real thorn in the side of the Canadian goverment . Like I posted they got naked and burned down everything they owned. They emigrated from Russia. [Apparently there are several books now with same title.] The burn down your house trick won't really work. This is NOT a must have book unless you really LOVE Canadian history.
 
James lives at the farm 100% of the time. I'm still in Dallas.

The farm consists of about 5 different parcels according to the deed record. The house is on one parcel and includes 1 acre. We paid our taxes in person last December and requested the homestead exemption for the house. Now its gone. Why?

All the parcels, except the house, produce hay(weather permitting).

To my knowledge, you are allowed one homestead exemption regardless of occupancy time.

Ag exemptions are not subject to anyone living on the property otherwise livestock pastures, grain fields, etc., wouldn't qualify for an ag exemption.
 
Are you sure that increase was just for the house? and not the acreage (or lot) its built on?They house may not have increased, however the majority of that overall increase could be from the lot or acreage the house sets on.

The last assessment done here, the house/buildings itself didnt increase but very little however the lot and the acreage is what casue the overall assessment to increase substantially. (thanks to developers selling 1/4 acre lots for $70,000 and people paying between $9,000 and $12,000/acre for land).

Basic steps for disputing an assessment here is as follows. Have your own appraisal done, have comparisons of neighboring propertys recent assessments, schedule hearing, be polite yet firm, state your reasons and then ask them to explain step by step how they came upon the new assessment figure.


Either way keep us updated on the outcome.
 
can"t speak at all to land / house worth in your area, but good luck " fighting the man "
around here ( rural southern ontario ), 1 acre and any kind of shelter over you head would be worth $140,000
kinda think these guys just hammer people & hope they don"t appeal it
bob
 
Most recent sale of property in our area was approx. $2,300/acre. Property value for house and 1 acre increased by $50,000.
 
We here Oregon and California passed a tax reduction and told they could only increase taxes by 2 percent a year. It really sets them back and tells them that we run the state not them. Get a copy of prop 13 in CA and ours here in OR then get a petition up and show them who the boss is. In 20 years my taxes have gone from $600 to $700 without the new law no telling what I would have to pay. By the way property values have decreased by about third in the last couple of years all over.
Walt
 
Try this:

Have your husband go into the review board, and walk with a cane and a limp. Then tell them that the old homestead is a plain ole dump. (and have pictures showing it to be) Cant afford to fix it up cause he has had a bum leg for years, no health insurance.
These sharks may have pity on you. If not then get a dozer and take on city hall.
 
I will only say what we have todo.Homestead=Paper filing,goes before Audtor board,6-12 Months delay plus prove you are still living each yr.One address only.Ag=filing fee(each parcel) to enter,proof of farming each yr(writen)and "IF"you change anything(wording-etc)then you have to start all over again.Every thing we do has to be on paper plus sometimes filing fees,asking doesn't get you anything.Hope you get it taken care of,but you didn't mention any HOOPS you jumped thru.
 
Like what Bob mentioned about Californina and Oregon, Mass has had a 'propostion 2 and a half' for probably 30 odd years now. So if last year's taxes were $100, this year it would be no more than $102.50. And that was only if the values went up all, or there were voted on needs for an increase- new school, water project etc.
All across the world real estate values are going down- so I find the tractor talk land value stories interesting, and I'm sure 'localized'. If your locality hasn't boomed with the gas rush, you got a bunch of crooked politicians there. Just look in the counties records in the paper or ask a real estate salesman what places like yours are selling for. If they are 'selling for' not asking for- say- 250,000..... don't say anything to anybody. If they are selling for just in the 80,000's like you figure yours is worth, contest it. You will win. Just don't expect anything from your town government for a long time to come...
 







































Good luck been tring to get mine at the value it would sell for.The little town mostly blew away in the tornado in Marysville Ind.the county tax lady was on tv,and reassessed the town so they wouldnt pay to much very fair but she then said houses in area not hit taxes will increase to make up the loss money.
 
Well you know how Dallas county works. They have convicted more innocent people than any county in the state. When I lived up there. I got a ticket for not having a fence around my pool. Called the city and told them. Come find my pool and I will put a fence around it. Neighbor got a ticket for to many cars in his drive way. He only had one.Took me three and a half years to get my dead wife off of the jury role.
 
You can fight and win. Went through the same thing 5 years ago at the height of outrageous property valuations. Was told by people useless to fight! But when value went from 168,000 to 348,000? (2-story house, fairly new and 7 acres of land with only 2 acres clear) Dang right I fought it! Got 90,000 knocked off value and ended up paying less taxes with new rate set! City hall always rejects arguments here. Had to wait 'til board of adjustments met and they were helpful and sympathetic to My plight and gave Me what I wanted! Be persistent and follow the rules and You can win!

Scott
 
With farmers paying 8000 or more an acre for farm ground it raises everyones taxes.Our county hires the tax appraising done so they don't have to argue with people.
 
Owch !! Now they may want to send a codes enforcement officer and condemn your place unlivable till it is up to code.
 
Here in Wichita County, TX. the appeal board are the local realtors…like the fox is in the chicken coop. You have to use their words against them. First…Location, Location, Location…show them what is bad about your area with pictures and address, also any pipe lines or other things which would devalue your property including issues with the current structures. Make sure the listing is correct on the tax record…year built, square footage of all structures, and use. Worked for me twice so for. It did increase but not as much as they wanted.
 
That will do no good. I have been disabled since 93. I don't even mow the grass. Taxes keep going up just like the next.
 
But that is not too far from the rate of inflation over that time. Today"s dollar buys about what 1970"s dime would buy.

The property taxes I pay now are quite a bit more than 10 times what I paid in 1976, when I got my property. On the other hand, I have lots more development of the ground, so it is not comparing oranges to oranges. I hate to pay taxes, but that is the way my area finances most government services, like schools, the fire department and county government. So I pay them.

A lot of the increase of valuation in my area has come from the FACT that people have sold parcels of land nearby for lots of money. And the fact that neighbors have built large expensive homes makes my area a higher value neighborhood, even though my house is modestly sized and not a bit fancy. I like it here, so I stay.
 
The towns here spend beyond their means.5 of my ss checks go to town taxes.If I was here alone I would have to sell out.Phoney real estate values are used in assessing taxes.
 
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