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traffic light and speed cameras....

A

Anonymous-0

Well-known Member
I know some of you folks don't agree with them but I support them (especially when I get flashed/charged :roll: ) Anyway, a new twist on a local redlight camera is aside from flashing when the light is red, it's set to randomly snap pics as cars cross the sensor even on green. If someone gets flashed on a green light, no problem. Unless they aren't wearing a seatbelt or are on a cellphone, texting, etc......
No muss/no fuss and no cops getting shot when they pull someone over...

let 'er rip......

Dave
 
My wife and I were in Norway a few years ago visiting relatives and the traffic cameras are quite common over there. If you get caught speeding it is your own dumb fault as there are signs well in advance that warn of the cameras ahead. Not all are at intersections. I recall some being in tunnels as well. Wouldn't be a bad way to operate it here... that being said, I don't want 'em here.
Cal
 
Never been ticketed by them but I am totally against them. I
wish to be faced by my accuser. Fines were established as a
punishment, which they should be. But if you ask many of the
governmental agencies that own these cameras and they will tell you that they are profit
centers, which is wrong

Government is in our lives too much already and now another digital
picture, invading my privacy that will end up in what governmental archive????????? Or worse yet on Facebook, ebay, or iCantHireYouNow.com

In case you think Im wrong, read George Orwell"s "1984".........
Big Brother is watching!!!!!!!!!
 
Dave in Germany you don't have the Bill of Rights. So if you like big brother watching you, then that is great for you. Remember that when they decide that they can look in your home/person/etc 24-7 without any court order. I seem to remember someone over there doing a real job of that on any Jew about seventy years ago. It all starts with one "little" step.

The speed cameras are not too bad at doing what they where intended to do, slowing down drivers. I still think that it is too much big brother and just a money generator for Govt. The red light cameras cause more serious problems. They do make fewer people run red light but cause way more rear end collisions. I have seen several people killed because they slammed on their brakes on a yellow light in front of a heavy truck. Also the cities with them are shorting the yellow. MORE MONEY!!! Here in Iowa the city of Cedar Rapids is being sued over it. The city admitted that they shortened the yellow time by five seconds. Does not sound like much but at higher speeds that means you can't get stopped in time. There is one light here on ,RT 13 a 4 lane, that at the posted limit, 55, you have eight seconds to get stopped during the yellow. Try that at 55 with a 80,000 lbs semi. There has been seven people killed at that light in the last two years. Everyone of them was hit from behind. The last one was a kid just learning to drive that got stopped, skidded the car, then the car behind him hit his car and shot the car load of Drivers ed kids under a passing Dump truck. Only three of the four died so I guess the money the town gets will make up for it.

If I remember right you are involved in base security??? The reason I ask this is that there is a big difference in opinion between law enforcement and the average citizen on this subject. Most law enforcement type would love to be able to camera everyone 24-7 then just have banks of computers writing tickets.
 
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way it is mostly ran here is a contractor has a camera. When he flashes someone, the pic has the face, frt and rear plate, gps location, time/date, and date camera/radar was calibrated (often)..... Frees up cops to keep the real crooks under control.... Nothing about big brother... Caught is caught, just obey the law.. At the same time, lights are standard and not ran by bubba.. Nothing is perfect, had an old guy on a tractor snapped at 180kmh several years ago when a crotchrocket passed him... Made him famous for awhile on his little 16hp porsche....... Folks are just dumb too..... some smart cop posted a pic on the net about cameras hidden in trash cans.... All they had to do then was set trash cans out randomly and folks slowed down......

Don't think anyone drives in thier living room so privacy isn't an issue.. 'sides, if a cop pulls you over for speeding, he might find that dope you smoke before makin them pissyass little jabs you like to throw at me.....
 
(quoted from post at 03:37:57 01/04/12) <img src="http://image.spreadshirt.net/image-server/image/composition/21034389/view/1/producttypecolor/5/type/png/width/280/height/280/don-t-feed-the-trolls_design.png">
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Now that's a creative way to avoid making yourself look a hick....... Just throw sumpin out there in an attempt to make the other guy look like the a$$..... I'm not trying to start an argument at all, just sharing an opinion....
 
Well Dave,
I would suggest you search the archives here for 'traffic cameras' and read the dozen or so other threads that have been on the board about this topic.
Then again, you probably wouldn't find much because they ALWAYS got out of hand and the poof monster made them disappear.
 
We've got a few redlight camera's around here. Definitely a revenue stream freeing up LEOs.

Shorting the yellows was tried as a revenue enhancer. Apparently caught someone in the statehouse as it didn't take long before the state legislature got involved enough to pass a law about the length of the yellow lights (don't remember if it was a straight time limit or sliding based on speed limit).. they got longer and the rear end issue went down
 
do you get in trouble over there if you moon those cameras? they seem rather upset when you do it here lol
 
I think there'r great, like you say it free's up the
officers for the real police work. If your breaking
the law, your breaking the law, if someone else is
driving your vehicle you should still be responsible
for it. These people who are always complaining
about big brother don't want to be responsible for
anything!
 
My problem with em is that you are supposed to be able to face your accuser in a court of law. I'm still waiting for a camera to testify or be available for a cross examination. Most of the cams are set up by contractors. I wouldn't have as much of an issue if a cop was reviewing the cam but most of the time it's some smuck hired off the street.

Privacy? You don't have much on PUBLIC road. Only inside the vheicle that cannot be seen from outside the vehicle. Kinda like the guy in Fargo a couple of years ago who got busted for a portable meth lab. Seems that when he got pulled over for a traffic violation the cop saw it in the back seat of his car. Now had it been in the trunk he'd of had privacy.

Rick
 
So far I'm glad they don't have those ,yet, in my town ! I have really bad luck with lights turning right as I get there. Others seem to sail along and the light waits just for them ?
 
They had one put up in the next town over. Media spread it all over the news that it was coming. Police Dept. said it was because of accidents at one particular corner and they inteded to lower that number as well as make a few bucks too.
Contractor installs cameras. City makes a few bucks, but not many because the owners of the cameras take most of it. Half the vehicles never reply to the notices, partly because we are on the Mexico border. But the best part, traffic accidents at the intersection nearly tripled in the first few months. Police Dept. blamed the media. Go figure. Cameras gone now, life is back to normal.
 
If someone doesn't like a camera busting them, best and most foolproof method of avoiding prosecution would seem to be OBEY TRAFFIC LAWS. I'm all for them. Then again, I've been broadsided twice in my life by drivers who blew through a red light.
 
Utter garbage those things. They proven than installing the cheap
cross walk count down timers that drivers can see improves
intersection safety and reduces red light running better than the
cameras. Its just a type of tax, cities get addicted to revenue and
like to tighten up yellows to boost it.

I got dinged by a radar camera out west one time, except I wasn't
speeding and had a gps recording my speed and position at the
time. Look into photo radar, it just returns the strongest signal and
the operator has to guess what car it belongs too.
 
I have not one but two opinions.

As a Conservative and a person who respects the police and laws I say if you obey the law and dont run a light THEN YOU HAVE NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT. Driving is a privelige NOT a right

As an Attorney I have some Constututional issues about the right of the accused to face, confront and cross examine his accuser. NOTE Im NOT sayingthis is any correct constitutional argument, Im ONLY saying its an issue I as an attorney might possibly raise in good faith...

This has been litigated and I havent done any legal research in any states and thsi is wayyyyyyyyyyyy to complex for discussion here so dont taKE thiS worth a cent more then you have paid IE NOTHING

John T
 
Sure would be nice if light changes would be standardized across our country...I am the rear escort for a 200 foot long truck, and every day we find lights where the truck cannot clear the intersection before the light goes red again.(Even if we are the first at the intersection) Kinda leaves me out there unable to do my job unless I break the law by blowing the red light.

If it was about safety and not just revenue enhancement, all it takes is a few strategically placed dummies in old cop cars to slow traffic down, and extending the yellow lights so folks do not have to skid to a stop when the light turns yellow. Those unmanned speed displays work pretty well too.

I am against the independent contractor operated red light cameras as you can't fight them fairly... and they do make mistakes.
 
Some one here posted U Tube red light cameras that run 24/7. Some really bad accidents were recorded. In my area the cities and counties just put up the camera signs and no cameras. Must work for a while. My best red light runner was an 18 wheeler. One Sunday morning waiting a long light at the red light and no traffic going by - Just as it went green the truck pulled on the air horn and run the red light a a very high rate of speed. Now this is a CDL driver so just think about all the guest workers.
 
(quoted from post at 06:41:20 01/04/12) If someone doesn't like a camera busting them, best and most foolproof method of avoiding prosecution would seem to be OBEY TRAFFIC LAWS. I'm all for them. Then again, I've been broadsided twice in my life by drivers who blew through a red light.
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Yeabut it was his godgiven right to blow that intersection.... You shouldn'ta been in his way.....

Ain't that right folks?????
 
(quoted from post at 07:36:41 01/04/12) I would be for them if they were set up correctly, would take 8 camaras for a 4 way intersection and they were all recording all the time to one recorder and being recorded all on one screen with 2 views, close and distance, from each distance. And then they shpuld be permanate mount and not portable with signes a block away that they are in use. And then I would agree the lights need to be timed correctly. And for not being able to confront the acuser the actuall moving camara picture would have to be made avaible to you to contest what it saw. And it would have to be owned and controled by the police department, not some outside company.
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Could it be we are talking about different types of cameras..... I could see someone being upset if they thought they were being constantly recorded... These (that I am talking about) are set up to get (flash) just the offender either by a radar sensor on a portable setup or a sensor buried in the pavement for redlights......
 
I would be for them if they were set up correctly, would take 8 camaras for a 4 way intersection and they were all recording all the time to one recorder and being recorded all on one screen with 2 views, close and distance, from each distance. And then they shpuld be permanate mount and not portable with signes a block away that they are in use. And then I would agree the lights need to be timed correctly. And for not being able to confront the acuser the actuall moving camara picture would have to be made avaible to you to contest what it saw. And it would have to be owned and controled by the police department, not some outside company.
 
Any time something that makes law enforcement's job easier, it's automatically an infringement on someone's rights.

All you "Moral Orels" out there... I guess it's okay to break the law as long as you don't get caught?

You can still take these tickets to court if you want, and "face your accuser," but you better have a darn good excuse to explain why a picture CLEARLY shows your face, your license plate, and your car in the middle of the intersection with a red light.

Betcha $100 the escort vehicle driver would get the ticket dropped. HOWEVER, if you're moving something that big through town, don't you need police escort? Even if you don't need it, it might be a good idea to have.
 
I didn't realize that! I know they used to be in the twin cities but now that you mention it there was a court case about them. Well that is something we will have to work on when we regain some logic in our lawmakers! The only ticket I ever got was for a red light violation and that was by a real officer 40 years ago, so it doesn't matter to much to me, except it would be nice to catch more of the violators. As long as we can't raise taxes on the wealthy we could raise some revenue from the law breakers!
 
Several large jurisdictions have removed their red light cameras because revenues have failed to even approach promises and are continuing to decline as successful court challenges have been made.

The trend is likely to continue.

Dean
 
THAT is the ENTIRE deal right there! It's not a program to "help LEO's do thier jobs" - it's a REVENUE MAKING program.
 
(quoted from post at 09:03:21 01/04/12) THAT is the ENTIRE deal right there! It's not a program to "help LEO's do thier jobs" - it's a REVENUE MAKING program.
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No broken laws = no revenue then right??? Where's the problem??? Once again, caught is caught... a fancy lawyer can twist a cops words around to where noone is sure that bubba was driving the car at said place & said time at said speed... All the while paying a judge, jury, witnesses, yadda yadda and john Law can't be out lookin for bad guys cause he is in the courtroom.... That little picture says the whole story without all the taxdollars wasted...

Better quit now afore UDM throws his troll card again.....

You guys're pluggin up my BS filter.....
 

There IS always that "Spot", (give-or-take 50 ft) where you either STOP or let it go...I wonder just how "Close" they generally figure is the limit..?? I don't make panic stops generally, I don't like to clean Face-prints off the Dash..!!
"Hold on Maggie"..( Bassett/Shepherd mix what a HOOT..)..!!!
I wonder how that will work on a really Large intersection with Heavy traffic that keeps flowing off I-270, at Sawmill Rd. in Cols. (Ohio).
The traffic keeps right on going until the complete intersection if JAMMED full and nobody can move..
Maybe that would just require a couple Cruisers strategically positioned...!!
Why do I always seem surprised to see that most people act like SHEEP..???
Think about that...!!!

Ron..
 
City of Sioux Falls, SD got taken to court by a guy who wasn't
driving the vehicle but was charged with going through the red
light. He could prove somebody else was driving his vehicle at the
time. City lost and shut the camera down. Word was they might
have to pay back all the fines they collected on the camera as a
settlement.
 
do the crime do the time yellow does not mean speed up used to do not ENTER on yellow. Revenus has nothing to do RED STOP
 
did you hear about the blondie who got into a accident,,she heard that when you run the red light you get your pic taken,,,she was fixing her hair and make-up while running the red light to look perfect....lol,lol
 
I think they need to occupy the redlight.........government is out of hand and the traffic lights are the 1%.........
I received a ticket from Dallas, the only problem is that I was in arizona at the time. My brother borrowed my truck. I sent them a copy of my hotel bill from the same date and asked them to try and find who was in the truck on their own since I wasn't in Dallas at the time. After a few nasty phone calls it was resolved. if they ever show up out here, the cameras will have an unfortunate series of accidents.
 
(quoted from post at 09:53:18 01/04/12) City of Sioux Falls, SD got taken to court by a guy who wasn't
driving the vehicle but was charged with going through the red
light. He could prove somebody else was driving his vehicle at the
time. City lost and shut the camera down. Word was they might
have to pay back all the fines they collected on the camera as a
settlement.
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You folks would prolly call me the hangin judge..... Your car, your responsibility.... If you let someone drive it and they screw up, two choices 1) suck it up 2) give their info to the PTB and let them be charged...

That's the way it is for soldiers/civilians stationed over here... You are responsible for your vehicle and have to clear up misunderstandings.... Stuff don't get thrown out, up to you to see that it gets paid....
 
Dave2 lets agree to disagree---I don't need the gov to hold my hand. nor do I need them to tell my how to live every aspect of my life, I do believe in personal responsibility-but am tired of freedoms lost due to good intentions.
 
Easy to say....let it be my responsibility....get the law off my back.

Then some fool in a hurry runs a red light and kills your daughter and your only grand child.

Would you still be standing up for his rights?

Old saying: Your right to swing your arm ends at my jaw.
 
The problem is their are instances where the data
on the camera did not match the vehicle and the
owner cited, some early attempts at the red light
cameras kind of eliminated a little thing called
due process.And the idiots running the camera
concession weren't smart enough to know when to
call no joy. Had a SSGT in our squadron that was
being hassled by the Nazis (really the German
government) for speeding on the camera, only
problem is he was not in Germany at the time of
the instance, the car in question was in the hands
of a GERMAN DOD contractor who was delivering it
to port to ship to the US. Took our 1st shirt the
better part of three months to make that go away,
wonder of Ole is allowed back in Germany by now?
 
(quoted from post at 10:20:27 01/04/12) Dave2 lets agree to disagree---I don't need the gov to hold my hand. nor do I need them to tell my how to live every aspect of my life, I do believe in personal responsibility-but am tired of freedoms lost due to good intentions.
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Whatever ruffles your skirt...... Sure don't want any hard feelings and you nice folks thinkin I'm abrasive or sumpin......

I live outside a 70k population city... In 22 years, I've had 2 accidents 1 when I was on a bicycle in a bike path when outside the gate of the barracks... Doin fine til a lady rolled out the gate (thru a stopsign) talking on her phone and nailed me..... Couple years later, I was sitting at a light, turned green and I got rearended hard enough to total my car by a soldier that was on his phone to call his boss that he'd be late for work....
Gave up trying to count the times I've had to stop short before going into the crosswalk from the parking lot to work because someone has a phone jammed to thier ear and doesn't stop for the crosswalk......

What's more important, my life/health or your privacy??? Again, if you don't break the law, the camera don't flash.....
 
(quoted from post at 10:52:30 01/04/12) There are enough places you can roll right along and not obey the law to the fullest extent without having much chance of being caought by John Law. But most of the lights that are put in aren't cheap to put in and are there for a good reason. Usually because of traffic density and speed. And because people just don't have enough common sense to drive like anything other than fools if they think they can. Why do they still have accidents at four way stops? Why do we have accidents if everyone has been tought to drive properly? If we knew that answer, we wouldn't have to have traffic cops or lights. Yeah, I don't like them any more than you do. But if it slows down or makes one fool stop more quickly as I get into the intersection, then I say have at it. The things do save a lot of lives,and the idiots out there do slow down some for them. It's just a shame there is any need for them.
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Careful..... UDM'll call ya a troll in a minute......
 
There are enough places you can roll right along and not obey the law to the fullest extent without having much chance of being caought by John Law. But most of the lights that are put in aren't cheap to put in and are there for a good reason. Usually because of traffic density and speed. And because people just don't have enough common sense to drive like anything other than fools if they think they can. Why do they still have accidents at four way stops? Why do we have accidents if everyone has been tought to drive properly? If we knew that answer, we wouldn't have to have traffic cops or lights. Yeah, I don't like them any more than you do. But if it slows down or makes one fool stop more quickly as I get into the intersection, then I say have at it. The things do save a lot of lives,and the idiots out there do slow down some for them. It's just a shame there is any need for them.
 
Hey Truck, I can appreciate your comments--Saw Guy Turner deliver 2 400+ ton presses to machine shop several years ago. Two 19 axle rigs, 205 feet long, rear steer/crab, KWs with 650 hp IIRC. Amazing what those guys could do with them on urban streets. Police escort at intersections to avoid problems. Not trying to hijack thread, but those were some impressive rigs and drivers!!!!
 
Red light cameras have not stopped and will not stop some folks from disregarding signal lights.

Dean
 
City of Minneapolis got into a dust-up 4 or 5 years ago. Someone found the state statute that says the driver must be identified. It was proved that reflections from sunshine or even a streetlight can block the camera's view of driver. City had to refund all fines paid on camera tickets, remove the violations from their license records, & dismiss all tickets that had not been paid yet. Don't have the figures at hand, but somewhere around a million bucks involved.
It may be different in other states & countries, but here the owner is resposible for accident damaged caused, or allowing a non-qualified driver (drunk, unlicensed etc) to drive, but otherwise the driver is responsible for moving violations.
Willie
 
Did you ever think that mabey he approached that intersection thinking he had a green light? I've lost count of how many times I've nearly pasted someone with the tandem because I had someone in front of me who decided to pile on the binders to stop for a yellow light... Around here they have mag strips in the collector intersections on highways and if a car trips those sensors... you could get a 4 second yellow, 5 seconds after a green. When you've got a truck wound up to highway speed with the expectation of a green light... and some boyscout in front of you decides to stop... he has a high chance of meeting his maker. Likewise, if you plow out into that intersection, you do as well. The truck driver might break the laws of the land but he's not going to break the laws of physics... and he's not going to stop.
I never EVER proceed into an intersection until I know it's OK to do so, regardless of what the light says.

Rod
 
If my friend or brother or who ever borrows my car
and gets his picture taken breaking the law, guess
who pays the fine, not me. No DFL in me either and
good for the camera. If a person has no honesty, he
has nothing. Breaking the law is dishonest.
 
(quoted from post at 11:58:36 01/04/12) If a person has no honesty, he
has nothing. Breaking the law is dishonest.
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Running a redlight or speeding doesn't make you dishonest but it's sure easy to make yourself into an idiot trying to avoid gettin caught.....
 
I got a call from a neighboring state a couple years ago about running a red light and a $125 fine, and how would I like to pay for it?

I asked them about the car and the date and they told me about my license plate on a white Camaro. I reminded them they could consult the Missouri Department of Revenue records and find out about that plate on my gray van. They decided to recheck their picture after I told them I'd gladly pay the fine if I could come and collect my new Camaro.
 
After reading some of the comments here, I now have a better understanding of how this country is turning into, or more toward a police state. Seems most people just love increased government control and regulation. After all, the red light cameras are good, because they get those lawbreaking redlight runners. Police roadblocks are good, because they are getting those awful drunk drivers off the road. Who cares if your travel is slowed as you go through the roadblock, and go through your police checkover to unsure YOU are not one of the bad guys, better not have any unpaid tickets.
The seatbelt/helmet laws are great things too, because you are too stupid to lookout for your self. The state will do it for you, and take your money if you don't comply. No smoking laws are another great thing the state has decided for us too. And how about those TSA goons at the airports feeling up old ladys and kids, It's all about our safety. I've read where they are going to expand the TSA, put them out on the roads, bus/train stations and even shopping malls. Just think how much SAFER we will all be. So it's all good.
The govenment is tighting regs and control all around us, and most of the people can't get enough. Don't deal in government unapproved "RawMilk", that will get you a swat team raid at the farm.
Won't be long, after the gov run healthcare gets up and running, They will decide your approved diet and exercise program. You'll get with their program, because after all it's for your own good, or your healthcare premiums will just have to go up until you get yourself into Government approved shape.
Somebody mentioned the book 1984 with big brother, we're heading there, and in some ways we have already arrived.
Jack
 
First off,Dave2,I never got a any red light tickets.However our local town "HAD"8 sets.The problem was Legal right turns,left turns on arrow,stopping too close to line,a big truck or car with trailer with back axle crossing sensor even tho the driver had a green light when he went thru,shortened yellows(less then st.required time).PLUS it was a civil matter,not a traffic infraction that you had to deal with a company in Az.who took 3/4s the money(fine) and to protest,you had to pay the fine plus double it to have a hearing(private party)and it went against your credit rating if not paid in so many days.A long way to explain it,but most people Never got their hearing or money back,so you can see why there is so much mistrust of them.Even the mayor and council thought it would be a good money maker because they(city)didn't have any cost to it.
 
(quoted from post at 13:11:27 01/04/12) First off,Dave2,I never got a any red light tickets.However our local town "HAD"8 sets.The problem was Legal right turns,left turns on arrow,stopping too close to line,a big truck or car with trailer with back axle crossing sensor even tho the driver had a green light when he went thru,shortened yellows(less then st.required time).PLUS it was a civil matter,not a traffic infraction that you had to deal with a company in Az.who took 3/4s the money(fine) and to protest,you had to pay the fine plus double it to have a hearing(private party)and it went against your credit rating if not paid in so many days.A long way to explain it,but most people Never got their hearing or money back,so you can see why there is so much mistrust of them.Even the mayor and council thought it would be a good money maker because they(city)didn't have any cost to it.
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Much different here...Guess I could see folks getting upset... Here, whatever happens (light, speeding, following too close) you get a ticket in the mail with all the info. If you know you were wrong, pay up and move on. If you don't remember being in the area (could take 8 weeks + for the ticket) or there are extenuating circumstances, you write or call and they will send you pics with all the info and a form to contest it (goes to the law and not the contractor). At that time, pay or contest. If you contest, you may win, if you loose it'll cost you about double.... You have the freedom of choice.......
 
Dave2, just a few things to thinks about. First in maryland they take the rear part of the vehicle. I read somewhere a long time ago that a state took a picture of the front and sent the ticket to the drivers house, problem was the women with him wasn't his wife and he sued the state. And that is a privacy issue. By the way it wasn't me. I got a ticket a few years ago from a stop light camera. The yellow light came on and I put the brakes on hard and went into the intersection a little. It was 9 at night nobody around and the judge said I should have backed up. You guys are getting yourself into a false sence of secruity. There are so many intersections that don't have your red/light cameres, that I don't see where you guys feel so safe. They have them in Maryland and it seems like they put where they haven't had that many accidents in the first place, just heavy traffic. In my opinion its just an easy way of taxing. And if you guys like this just wait till the car computers get better and a cop can stop you plug in and see when and where you were speeding, beleive me its coming and DON'T tell me you guys are perfect because knowone is perfect and just think of that nightmare. Now I know howcome the Jews went into the Gas chambers. I can't beleive the comments from a country where we are suppose to be to smart. I guess everyone will be ok with camera's being in your house one day JUST to make sure you don't hit your wife or do something your not suppose to do. I think that would be ok just think of all the women that would be saved. Just a thought. ED
 
Jack, I fully support your right to smoke, ride a cycle without a helmet, or bungee jump. If you kill yourself...so be it...it is your life.

But society doesn't work that way. Go down to the nursing home and visit the 35 year old drooling vegetable in diapers, who tried to exert his rights but only succeeded in becoming a long-term, million dollar burden on the society whose rules he hated and flaunted.

Yeah, I know, these macho men would refuse to be treated and would insist on dying in the street like a real men.....but what about their widows and orphans who will likely be on welfare and medicaid for years.

Macho talk is easy, but after I did some homework I found out who really foots the bill for the smokers with cancer and the helmet less riders. We all do.

My wife once told me as I embarked on one of my more risky vacation adventures, "If you have an accident, make it a big one. Don't come home a cripple and expect me to nurse you for life."
 
I wonder if a lot of you guys who are so in favor of those darned cameras don't live out in the rural areas and don't have to drive through many traffic lights.
Lately I've been working in St Paul and so commute through the back streets from Minneapolis as it's quicker and easier than facing freeway traffic between the two cities.
Between home and the job site there are probably 30 lights that I have to cross in the 12 miles each way.
That's 60 lights each day X 250 working days a year = 15,000 lights per year. That's just going to work and Not counting going to get groceries, tractor parts, visiting friends or catching a movie.
So make it more like 20,000 lights per year that I have to cross.
How many of you here are such good, law abiding drivers that you can time the yellow or stop completely before turning on red and do it perfectly EVERY time?
Driving, like baseball is a game of skill, chance and luck - with a LOT of split second decisions thrown in.
Can you hit the ball 100% of the time?
Can you do it 20,000 times a year so as to not get a spendy ticket?
Babe Ruth only had a lifetime batting average of .342
Think about it.
We drivers in America do a pretty good job of playing the game with billions of lights crossed and trillions of miles driven each year.
We don't need computer cams penalizing us if we don't bat 1000.
 
Though I have nothing to fear, the Constitution says you have the right to face your accusors. Who is the accusor? The camera. Dave
 
I am against the stupid red light cameras, maybe I crowd the red lights too much, I used to stop for them until one day in beutiful Tampa Florida some drunk uninsured miscreant behind me decided he wasn't stopping and attempted to drive a CJ5 up the left tail pipe of my Mustang, and then wanted to beat the snot out OF ME because I stopped and the cops were going to come and find he had a suspended liscense and no insurance.
 
I'll take redlight cameras over traffic circles anyday.

Dave2, you have many traffic circles over there in Germany? Do they work well?

Minnesota started putting in single lane traffic circles about five years ago and the jury is still out on them. The idea was to reduce the number of fatal high speed T-bone collisions with more low speed no-injury fender-benders without the cost and inconvienience of a stoplight or 4-way stop sign on a rural high speed highway.

We have four traffic circles in our area. The one in a residential area is fine. It is probably un-neccesary except to teach the public what a traffic circle is. The three on 60 MPH two lane highways are white knuckle deals.

At first too many semi trucks drove straight through the center of the circles. One with a long trailer got stuck in the mud half way through the middle and blocked off the entire intersection. The state then put ten foot high dirt mounds in the centers to force everyone to drive around in the circle. Now you can't see for more than 1/4 of the circle in either direction. Younger folks have learned to park nearby, sit in lawn chairs and watch all the near misses and horn honking.

You Europeans must be better drivers than we are here, or at least are better than I am. I'll take a regular intersection with redlight camers over these traffic circles.
 
You live in an area where people at least attempt to "play the game" you described. Where I live, Willie and Leroy make no effort to play the game. They don't just try to beat the light, they ignore it altogether. You can't assume that just because you have a green light you have a clear path. I don't like Big Brother either, but I don't mind tracking these morons down by any means possible.
 
(quoted from post at 20:44:59 01/04/12) I'll take redlight cameras over traffic circles anyday.

Dave2, you have many traffic circles over there in Germany? Do they work well?

Minnesota started putting in single lane traffic circles about five years ago and the jury is still out on them. The idea was to reduce the number of fatal high speed T-bone collisions with more low speed no-injury fender-benders without the cost and inconvienience of a stoplight or 4-way stop sign on a rural high speed highway.

We have four traffic circles in our area. The one in a residential area is fine. It is probably un-neccesary except to teach the public what a traffic circle is. The three on 60 MPH two lane highways are white knuckle deals.

At first too many semi trucks drove straight through the center of the circles. One with a long trailer got stuck in the mud half way through the middle and blocked off the entire intersection. The state then put ten foot high dirt mounds in the centers to force everyone to drive around in the circle. Now you can't see for more than 1/4 of the circle in either direction. Younger folks have learned to park nearby, sit in lawn chairs and watch all the near misses and horn honking.

You Europeans must be better drivers than we are here, or at least are better than I am. I'll take a regular intersection with redlight camers over these traffic circles.
Click to expand...

Traffic circles all over and work pretty good for the reasons you mentioned.... I am not german or european, I come from Ohio....

Just as many idiot drivers here, they just pay accordingly and the cops don't fool around.. Wrong is wrong... I slip thru lights now and then if there is noone around (usually when I'm going in to night shift or Sundays but expect to pay if caught. Been flashed plenty by speed cameras also but made the choice to ignore the law so paid for it.

About driving skills, my license cost me 10 bucks (5 to take the 20? multiple choice test for the permit and 5 for another version of the 20 and driving around the block & paralell parking at 16.

age is 18 here, cost is 1500+ bucks and plenty of driving in all conditions with a country certified instructor. Then a 30+ minute drive with the license person. If you pass you get a flagged license for example, if you did everything in summer, you can't drive in winter until you spend a couple hours driving with an instructor... So, you have the best driver in the world til you stick a cellphone to their ear or they are late for work with their hair/makeup untidy......

What I see here is folks conform to the laws, back home, laws work around bubba and whatever lawyer he can afford

Cops don't waste time looking at truckdrivers for speed violations, they just randomly walk up to their truck at reststops and ask for their tachograph and act accordingly...

Don't want police brutality? Be have yourself... Bubba sticks his finger in a cop's face and says sumpin about his mama or takes a swing, they have this little spring loaded club that looks like something foghorn leghorn would use on that dog.... 1 whack'll make 3 or 4 before they let up.....
 
(quoted from post at 05:19:41 01/04/12) do you get in trouble over there if you moon those cameras? they seem rather upset when you do it here lol
Click to expand...

For the reason you got flashed, yes.... Then the video will prolly end up on a blooper TV show or youtube...... Don't know if you'd get punished for it.......

Cameras are just a fact of life.... People getting mugged in the subway & train stations.... Punks chunking firewood off overpasses and killing drivers/passengers driving underneath... Cops can't be everywhere...
You folks that are whining about privacy... What are ya gonna do when you meet your extra girlfriend for a latenight walmart rendevous and the camera sees you... Then the watch person just HAPPENS toknow the cousin of a cousin of someone that knows your wife???? BUSTED... Could be extra dangerous for folks in WV cause they could still be considered immediate family :shock:

Just Kiddin......
 
Talk about whining! Just smile for the picture and pay for the privelege of driving like a fool...
 
Those of you who are so opposed to this being a money making machine could offer to pay a bit more on your income taxes so this method of fundage would be unnecessary. The money has to come from somewhere.
 
(quoted from post at 19:31:35 01/05/12) Those of you who are so opposed to this being a money making machine could offer to pay a bit more on your income taxes so this method of fundage would be unnecessary. The money has to come from somewhere.
Click to expand...

LOL Well Said!

Couple of years ago there was a group trying to force Mn into passing a law that would require all gas taxes and plate taxes be used for the roads. If there was an excess it would be carried over and not rolled into the general fund. Idiots didn't stop to think that if they had been successful they would have raised other taxes to cover that loss of revenue.

Rick
 
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