O/T How can this be legal? Rant

I was on my way to work the other day and dump truck with a dump trailer pulled out in front of me. Had a landscaping companies logo on the side. So I assumed hauling rocks or scrub brush. But on the back of the dump truck and trailer it said "Not responsible for windshield damage" Which in my opinion is bull. If you have a load on your trailer and you fail to secure it no matter what it is you are responsible for any damage that occurs because of your load. If this is the legal I am writing "Not responsible for speeding" on the back of my truck.
 
Only thing I see here is the fact that in Pa the driver is to contain his load, if it be by making sure it is off the side boards, and frame. to tarping load. anything off the top of a truck is the responsibility of the driver.

If it is a stone picked up by a tire it is an act of God. therefore not a fault of the driver.

Had a guy stop me one day and told me I broke his windshield. I ask if it came off my load ?.. he said yes. I left him climb the side of my truck only to find it empty. the last load I had on was some drills for a coal auger.
 
I'm from PA too. So I'm pretty familiar with the laws. I'm in AZ for the summer on an internship. I know what you mean with the act of God and a stone in the tire treads. But this just blew me away seeing this.
 
i would be calling that company and telling the boss man, if you don't law suit from your driver cutting me off and dropping a rock in my windshield, i'd have a talk with him....i done that to a couple of yahoo's want a be truckers. been driving for 30 yrs, can't believe the dummies they hire today....
 
Maybe it is just to get tailgaters to back off a little!

I met a semi the other day near my house and got a quarter sized crack in my windshield from a rock. He wasn't going fast and neither was I....just got unlucky. It was from road gravel. I drive on gravel roads that the trucks use every day, all day, just a matter of time until the next one.
 
That's just stupid. I suppose there's no law against printing that on there. But maybe they figure if it works just once it's a big savings!!!!!!!
I recall years ago an idiot following me until I stopped. He wanted my info. because he said a stone came off my truck and cracked his windshield. I was hauling a fully covered load of cornmeal! If my mudflaps hadn't met the law, and he had gotten authorities there to check them out, then he could have had a case.
 
Truckers are responsible for damage caused to the property of others resulting from improperly secured loads regardless of what they may paint upon their trucks.

Such notices are not legally enforceable but may serve to deter some from filing claims.

That said, such folks will, no doubt, deny responsibility, regardless of the situation, requiring you to have persuasive evidence in order to collect damages.

I carry a digital camera in my vehicle for just such eventualities.

I also carry $0 deductable comprehensive insurance (very inexpensive) and have done so for decades. I simply submit the claim to my insurance company along with the license number and DOT numbers from the guilty party and let them follow up.

Dean
 
I have to agree with the others. If a load is not secure and causes damages then don't matter what you have printed on the back of your truck.
I have drove dump trucks and garbage trucks. Now with the garbage truck they spend a lot of time on the shoulder of the road going from house to house.
Was taking a full load of garbage to the dump one time and had a woman all of a sudden come up behind me honking her horn and flashing her lights. I pulled over got out and she was all upset said a rock came off of the tire and chipped her windshield. I told her nothing I could do about wasn't nothing to do with my load and a rock could come of anybodys tire thats why a person carries insurance. I did give her my insurance info to make her happy and told her to let them take it from there. That seemed to make her happy. I did check up latter with my boss and he talked to the insurance company and they never payed a claim out for it that was up to her insurance company in a rock from a wheel situation.
Another time I was driving a 5 ton boxed delivery truck and ice started flying off the top of the box of the truck ahead of me. I was driving on the 401 through Toronto at the time at rush hour so couldn't move to the left or right lane, was boxed in, all I could do was slow down. Smashed the windshield so bad was about all I could do to see out of it not to mention about had to change my shorts I really thought a chunk of ice was going to go through and get me. Anyways chased the truck down, got his insurance info but they wouldn't pay up, was up to my bosses insurance to pay. Didn't agree with that but thats insurance.
 
That notice means nothing, although I've seen it on plenty of trucks. That said, I'm sure trucking companies get plenty of unsubstantiated claims from people who say their windshields were damaged by debris. My personal experience with windshield damage is it's usually caused by rocks thrown by tires rather than from loads.
 
Its legal! Even though he pulled out in front of you, the law, at least here, says you must follow 1 car length for evey 10 MPH, anything else youre tailgating, and if you hit the back of them, its your fault, not theirs. Even passing, if looked at in a certain way, is illegal. I think its a joke!
 
In Kentucky, trucks ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE for glass breakage. Each individuals own insurance covers glass on their own vehicles. Law is routed in the number of coal trucks on bad roads years ago....
 
I have to agree with co counsel Dean. While I'm sure NOT going to read every states statutes (to see if they agree with enforcement of a sign on a truck) at common law Im confident a sign on a truck claiming they are NOT responsible for damage for failing to properly and safely secure their cargo ISNT WORTH THE PAPER/STEEL ITS PRINTED ON.

They are attmepting to intimidate and its not possible to creat a UNILATERAL CONTRACT i.e. YOU DIDNT BARGAIN FOR, CONTARCT FOR, OR AGREE TO THOSE TERMS NOW DID YOU. Does it make sense to a lay person or an attorney that ONLY ONE party can create dictate or enforce a contract or agreement THAT THE OTHER PARTY DIDNT AGREE TO NOR HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE OF WHATSOEVER. If BOTH parties bargained for, there was a meeting of the minds, and it was agreed upon that if your trucks load isnt contained and such causes me damage, hey youre NOT responsible NOW THATS AN ENFORCEABLE CONTRACT but only one party unilaterally placing a sign on their truck deciding that if my load spills over and damages your car Im NOT responsible SORRY, THAT DONT GET IT.

HERES THE THING. Its well settled in the law that if one parties negligence (say failing to secure a trucks cargo) causes damage to another person THAT PERSON IS LIABLE. So only one person attempting to circumvent well settled and good law by placing a sign on their truck that attempts to change that law JUST DOESNT PASS THE SMELL TEST AT ALL, SORRY CHARLIE.

Thats my story n Ima stickin to it

John T Country Lawyer (Remember, I have NOT read every states statutes so no warranty, I'm ONLY arguing the common law of contract and negligence here........
 
its nessesary for several reasons, first while the driver is responsible for securing his load, just like any other truck, dump tucks do tend to sling stones, usualy its off the tires not the bed, these trucks by nessessity, have shorter mud flaps on the rear so they dont drag them off when dumping, also as ive driven them for 30 years, there is an incredible pastime goiong where the public sees these trucks as " get a free windshield time" ive had claimes filed on my trucks several times, even 2 tryed it when i didnt even have a load, never had to pay a claim, the general idea is you know these trucks carry rocks you know when leaving a job site they may have small stones packed in the tire treads, so, back off, and dont tailgate
 
In this area, most of the dump trucks you see hauling from stone quarries, gravel-sand pits, asphalt plants or construction sites, have a d.o.t. safety orange sign with black letters attached to the tail gate, which states "construction vehicle, do not follow". I am not sure what the law is, but I suspect the truck insurance provider(s) may have influenced this, you did not see as many now as there were say 20 years ago with this sign.

Unless the law says different, truck owner is responsible, or should be. It is clear who is causing an unsafe condition. Personally, I steer clear of dump trucks and lowboy's, whenever possible there is always something coming off them.


I will flat out say any driver who does not clean off the deck of a low boy trailer, the machinery he/she is hauling is belligerent and negligent, it's pure laziness. Same thing with the apron on the back of a dump body, sweep it off, that any any other place material can accumulate. Over the years I have seen people that don't care and the subsequent materials bouncing down the road. Granted, there are some people who follow these trucks looking for a claim or who make a big deal over nothing, it still does not make it right for a driver to not make sure the truck is clean.

I drove both these kinds of vehicles for a living, no reasonable employer is going to get on you for cleaning loose materials off any edges they can accumulate on. Other scenarios are faulty or poor quality tarps, where materials are blowing off. Common sense tells you to avoid getting behind these vehicles in the first place, but with traffic today and on/off ramps many times you have no choice, no place to go.

There is one local outfit that is a large operation with multiple quarry sites, I've called them and reported things with there trucks one was a driver had a load of gravel and his tailgate secured with a ratchet strap, material was falling out, just a friendly phone call, another time one had a brake shoe hanging up, smoke coming out, driver had no clue, called em and told em before he catches fire, I used to haul on their jobs, better than a cop catching them, courtesy call. I have a habit of taking license numbers, truck, trailer numbers, recording time and location, subsequently calling dispatch or someone who will take a complaint or the like seriously. Too many out on the road, which we all have to share.
 
I just had 2 windshields damaged in the same car,1 week apart,in the same spot of road and light traffic. There were people ahead of me but I was back pretty far. If I was tailgating the stones might not of got to my windshield. I'm just driving around with the 2nd damaged one until it splits farther across. Last replacement only made it 2 days on the road until I got 2 big stone chips in it.
 
It depends entirely on what your state laws say, but the "not responsible" sign isn't worth squat. It comes down to negligence vs a good faith effort to meet the statute.
 
EXACTLY The Civil Plaintiff has to prove his case by A PREPONDERANCE OF THE EVIDENCE. You say a rock flew off his truck and caused damage and he says it did not????????????? 50/50 is NOT a preponderance of the evidence, you need to tip the scales...

Good comment

John T
 
People can say what ever they want. Only the courts can say who is responsible under the law.

This is mearly a law suit deterent. The driver just points to the sign. Must be true because it is printed on a sign.

Lets face it, it worked on you, you believed it enough to post a "Rant" here.... This is not a knock to you, it works on all of us.

If the rock damaged my car, I say sign-schmine, pay for my $300 windshield or have your $300.00/hr lawyer answer the small clames court summonds.

They'll pay it is not worth there time or money.
 
Just because you file and serve a claim, does not mean it'll go to court.

The non-lawyer business owner cannot represent the business in court, (if soul-proprietor, then they probably can) Thus, the you will cause him to hire the $300.00+/hr lawyer. To go to court. or at the very least cause him to spend the time. This is your leverage to get the damage repaired prior to actual court.

What are the representation rule in your area John? I was told as the owners of an LLC I could not represent the LLC as it is its own legal entity.
 
Thanks for the kind words, but actually Im pretty well retired and have a very small limited practice, mostly probate, estates, deeds, wills, living wills, POA, HCPOA, contracts etc. Still one never forgets the basics

John T
 
Jeff, As the old saying goes, "Any man can be his own attorney, but he who does has a fool for a client" lol

I think youre on the right track, true a man can represent himself, but if that which he wishes to represent is NOT legally himself i.e. a seperate legal entity, a non attorney can not practice law before the bar I DID NOT RESEARCH THIS, ITS ONLY A SEMI EDUCATED OPINION/GUESS LOL

I'm sure more current and practicing attorneys like Mike or Dean would know for sure

John T
 
While agree some drivers dont take the time to clean off there trucks , there are those that do . I have drove dump truck for 30 years and I had the windshield of my brand new freightliner taken out from a rock picked up from a passenger car tire, WHO PAYS FOR THAT? well I did and I can tell you it cost way more than car windshield. Its not always the truck that breaks them any vehicle running down the road can pickup debris off the road, in a tire and throw it .
 
There are different signs but the ones Ive seen say stay back 300 feet,not responsible for broken windshields.
Now if you are too close,and I drive a dump truck sometimes,you could get a broken windshield.I see people do this all the time,even though I drive less than the speed limit so people will pass me,some will hang back there,at way less than 300 feet.I dont want rocks to fall off and hit their windshield but hey,pass me and go on down the road!
People driving cars seem to get dumber all the time.
Also the insurance companys are who came up with the idea for these signs.There are others too_One I remember was the Buckle up sign was required because the truck company had had a fatality accident so the had to put Buckle up for Safety signs on the back of their trailers.
So when you see this stuff dont just assume its the driver being arrogant.It has nothing at all to do with the driver for the most part.It may not even have anything to do with the company either,its just that they had to put the signs on to get insurance or something.
Your best bet is to pass on a 4 lane or stay way back on a 2 lane.I know everybody is in a hurry nowdays,but they will say you were following too close if your windshild is busted and very likely not have to pay for it.Also,because people are in a hurry,and could be too close,and do get their windshield busted,every windshield that sign saves the insurance company from buying adds up to lots of money in a year.
Ive had my own truck windshield busted by a dump truck more than once.Just dont follow them closely is better for you than trying to get them to buy you a windshield.
 
Sounds to me like they are just trying to discourage tailgater"s. After all, if you"re stupid enough to tailgate a dump truck you"re stupid enough to believe any sign they want to stick on the back. Hope it work"s!
 
Have to chime in here. In VA, if the object came from the truck, and hits the vehicle without contacting the road, the truck owner is responsible. If it was kicked up from the roadway by the tires, or contacts the roadway and bounces, your insurance is responsible.
And, yes, there are lots of folks looking for a free windshield, too! Headed home from elevator, truck empty, and 20' grain body covered with tarp. Lady passes me, cut back in front, slams on brakes, and puts right turn signal on. I have to swerve around her to keep from rear-ending her. Not realizing she was trying to stop me, I keep going. She tries again, but this time motioning for me to pull over. I did, thinking I had a truck problem or something, but had to go around again so I wouldn't nail her. Pulled over in front and got out. She starts off with "your truck picked up a rock and broke my windshield". Told her I was sorry, but law clearly states "vehicle not responsible for objects coming from roadway". Now she changes tunes. "But I saw it come from out of your truck". Told her truck was for grain, not gravel, body was fully covered, empty, and I have a certified Perdue Farms scale ticket in my pocket to prove so. She tells me she has my licence number and will call her insurance. I wished her luck and left her standing there looking stupid. Let my ins. agent know, we both had a good laugh and never heard another word about it.
 
What the sticker really means is that they arent going to allow people to tailgate and get a free windshield at their insurance expense.
I do understand your point but there are piles of unreasonable people out there that will sue for ANYthing. I would love to have a sticker that said "not responsible for speeding" "not responsible for road rage" "not responsible for kicking the schitt out of you"
 
Years ago we lived near a huge quarry and many windshields were broken out by trucks hauling rock...Often it was when you met them and not by following too closely...The county passed a law requiring the loads to be tarped but not everyone complied..It did help some...We were lucky and never lost a windshield but I got over on the shoulder when I met them....Several neighbors lost 3-4 windshields.
 
I once lived 2 miles from a huge quarry and it was often the person meeting the rock hauler that got the broken windshield,not the person that was following too closely..Most were loading too high and had no tarps..I often followed them from a distance and watched some pretty good sized stuff fall off and personally saw several people meeting the trucks get broken windshields..
 
Since I am a retired dump truck driver let me fill in the gaps some. Yes the load need to be loaded and tarped etc. But many people tail; gate dump truck and then claim that a rock from the truck cracked the windshield. Back when I was drive a dump truck I got stopped at least once a month by people trying to get new windshields and the funny thing was each time I got stopped I was running empty and one guy said that did not matter but he made a bigger mistake he pulled in behind me where I was about to be loaded up and there where 5 other truckers there and they all came to see what the problem was. The guy left pretty fast and a short time latter a cop had him pulled over for causing us problems seems one of the truckers call and reported him
 
NY State Law says, if it comes directly from the Truck and hits you, Truck is responsible.
If it Bounces off of the road or anything else first, it's a road hazzard, Truck is NOT responsible.
Stone laying on the road, thrown up by a tire is also a road hazzard.


Sign is meaningless..
 
Are you asking if it is legal to have that sign on there? Yes I think it is. I think you can write anything on your vehicle except "law enforcement" I painted my wife's name on the rider door of my truck but that was not always right as sometimes I would be hauling a driver trainee in that seat. Pretty sure I was still legal during those times. If your asking if it is legal for him to pull out in front of you? Depends on how close you were. That is a judgement call that would have had to be witnessed by law enforcement officer.
 
Well you must have not been employing the Big Truck Anti Road Hazzard Array.

I am not in the club but from observation this includes really pointy boots, a belt buckle the size of a volkswagon hub cap and a hokey fake southern accent on the CB radio!

I spent some of my formative years dodging recaps on the highway on my Honda.

Brad
 
Well, it seems that one of the local schools was having a 'career day' and had invited folks from various professions to tell about their life. One of the last ones was a cowboy and he explained his lifestyle, the good and the bad; he then asked if there were any questions. One little girl asked why he wore the big hat and he explained about the sun, skin cancer, etc. Another child asked about his chaps and he explained about the need to protect his legs from briars and thorns. He was also asked about his neckerchief, his snap-button shirt, etc. Finally, the teacher asked, "Why do you wear tennis shoes?" "So they can tell us apart from the @#$##%#&&*@@#$%$ truck drivers" :>)
 
I retired after 38 years of driving for a freight line.Over the 38 years I have had at least 12 or more windsheilds damaged from rocks & stones. Half of them were from passing cars. The other half were stones that come from tread of truck tires. I have two family members that drive dumps. Stone can't fall off load because they can't load trailer to top. Can't scale it if loaded to top.
 
Thanks everyone for the replies. He pulled out ahead of me but he wasn't causing a problem. It was going to a red light. I wasn't mad about that. Just the fact that that sign was there. I appreciate everyones response.
 
You still have to watch the hi lift operator or if loading at a tipple , stones can lay on tailgate and side boards.

sometimes when dumping stones can lay on a hitch or even the frame.
 
I owned and operated a triaxle dump for two years just prior to the end of home construction. I saw 3/4 stone sitting on top of side boards of trucks exiting the quarry many times. Stone is "light" relative to crusher run gravel. You can't get a full 23 ton load unless you have high side boards, so it is always right up to the top. Most loader operators are good and will "wipe" it off the boards if there is too much up there. Most drivers/ owners are good and will have boards that come to a point on top so that stone can't sit on it. Most drivers will stop and "trim' the load if needed, to keep stone from falling off. but there are still many that will drive down the road and let it fly where it will. The quarry that I hauled out of the most had one guy that was there the longest, was employed with his own truck nearly all year, and I never saw him once out of his truck to trim a load. He always drove fast, totaled two trucks in four years, and probably spilled more material on the roads than all the other drivers put together.
 

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