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fostersfarm 02-08-2010 11:31:22 71.110.145.16 462887 Report to Moderator	My "64 4000 lite ind. (4cy) has two relays. The picture shows one with the battery and starter cables plus other mystery, to me, wires. A coiled red #10 wire(not factory) connects to the second relay. #2 relay has a 3ft. #10 black wire with a pressed on/heated on "resistor?" on it at the relay connection. The two diagrams I have, one from here and one from VFTR, only show one relay. I do not think either diagram is specifically for the "64 but are for 12V diesel. What think? Foster [Reply]   [Send Email]
Brian Allen 02-09-2010 09:33:04 69.63.62.219 462992 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   I think it is quit time period! The posters on this forum are very helpful people, we all appreciate learning from "almost"every post. "If" a poster slips up, we owe it to him/her to give them a break. Just my $0.02 worth. Brian   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-09-2010 07:28:55 173.137.85.192 462976 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   I appologize that a couple of the members.. er.. well a member and a guest anyway.. are getting into a 'whose is bigger' bullying match over my post. I stated up front I wasn't completely familiar with your electricl system and thus was speaking in general terms. That's why I ID'd the 2nd relay for the thermal start aid generically by 'application', not knowing if it was factory or not.. I didn't want to steer you either way, other than what it's likely function was. hope you get the stuff straightened out with johns wire diagram. good luck soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
JMOR 02-09-2010 05:18:58 72.181.166.239 462959 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to Jared Lyde, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   john in La said: (quoted from post at 08:52:58 02/09/10) JMOR This diagram is only for the diesel tractors. Why they did not add the heaters to the diagram is unknown to me. Seems kinda strange, but with later 3 cylinder models, it looks like they did the same kind of 'add on thermo-start' diagram. Anyway, thanks for the response.   [Reply]   [No Email]
JMOR 02-08-2010 19:30:45 72.181.166.239 462937 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to RBnSC, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   john in la said: (quoted from post at 22:41:13 02/08/10) Here is the basic wiring diagram for your tractor. <img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y137/johnLA/436ebfb71.jpg"> To this we add the diagram for the intake air heaters. <img src="http://www.rieckesbaysidegallery.com/programfiles/talers/Capture.JPG"> It is hard to see where each wire hooks in your picture so I hope I get this right. The relay on the left is your starting relay. The relay on the right is for the starting heaters. It looks like the red curley wire hooks to the same spot as the battery on the strating relay and then to the other relay. This is the power wire for the heater relay. The long blue wire on the heater relay goes to the heaters. On the heater relay should be 2 small studs. 1 stud has a wire that goes to ground and the other stud is wired back to the keyed side of the terminal block with a push button switch wired inline on this wire. John, it looks to me like you have answered his question/solved his problem, but I have a curiosity question that you may or may not know an answer for, but since the basic diagram shows no distributor/coil etc. fr a gas engine, why isn't the manifold heater circuitry included in it? And further weren't the same vintage gas tractors 6v pos gnd?   [Reply]   [No Email]
john in La 02-09-2010 04:52:58 67.35.236.148 462957 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to JMOR, 02-08-2010 19:30:45   JMOR This diagram is only for the diesel tractors. Why they did not add the heaters to the diagram is unknown to me.   [Reply]   [No Email]
john in la 02-08-2010 18:41:13 67.35.236.148 462925 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   Here is the basic wiring diagram for your tractor. To this we add the diagram for the intake air heaters. It is hard to see where each wire hooks in your picture so I hope I get this right. The relay on the left is your starting relay. The relay on the right is for the starting heaters. It looks like the red curley wire hooks to the same spot as the battery on the strating relay and then to the other relay. This is the power wire for the heater relay. The long blue wire on the heater relay goes to the heaters. On the heater relay should be 2 small studs. 1 stud has a wire that goes to ground and the other stud is wired back to the keyed side of the terminal block with a push button switch wired inline on this wire.   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-09-2010 07:04:29 173.137.85.192 462971 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to john in la, 02-08-2010 18:41:13   Just curious.. did that come out of an ford 01 service manual, or out of the back of the I&T manual? thanks soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
john in la 02-09-2010 19:12:33 70.156.103.6 463044 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to soundguy, 02-09-2010 07:04:29   I have the ford shop/parts/owners manual uploaded to my computer so most if not all of the pictures I post come from those. This is Ford shop manual SE8175 from 1961.   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-10-2010 07:18:36 174.151.197.69 463076 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to john in la, 02-09-2010 19:12:33   Thanks! soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
Larry NCKS 02-08-2010 18:03:48 205.188.116.19 462924 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to Showcrop, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   soundguy said: (quoted from post at 17:29:26 02/08/10) Never said it wasn't factory.. soundguy[/quote:2cba4eeed8] Didn't ya now? What do you call this then? [quote:2cba4eeed8] if they did, then that was likely the scheme the prev owner used for energizing the thermal start aid.   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-08-2010 19:55:36 69.34.85.117 462943 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to Larry NCKS, 02-08-2010 18:03:48   It's exactly what I typed. it's the system the prev owner used to energize the thermal start aid. To put it in a way that you might understand it better. If you go buy a car from the dealer, sell it, and then the new owner yanks the ignition switch out of the steering column and throws it up on a wood table, and asks what this part is for.. and I tell them that was what the previous owner started the car with... does that make it not factory? remember.. words mean things.. I know you try to never miss an opportunity to disagree with me.. but ya jumped the gun on this one.. soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
Pipns 02-08-2010 20:36:41 64.255.180.28 462948 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to soundguy, 02-08-2010 19:55:36   Come on Sounder. Give it up. You didn't know and implied that it was some not-factory affair. It really is ok to not know everything in the whole world. No one expects it. You are starting to look laughable in this attemt at a"save". Quit time was some time back!   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-09-2010 07:01:59 173.137.85.192 462970 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to Pipns, 02-08-2010 20:36:41   Remember.. words -mean- things. I never said i did or didn't know it was factory.. in fact.. I said I wasn't familiar with that electrical system. I DID say that if it was hooked to the plug in the manifold that that was a pretty good indicator that it was for the start aid. My goal wasn't to imply one way or the other.. factory part or not factory part.. as was stated.. I don't know that elec system.. my point was to let the poster know that if the wire ran from the 2nd solenoid to the plug in the manifold that it had to do with the thermal start aid... I think you guys that are kicking this so much are the ones that are looking funny... I'm having a good laugh setting back yanking the chain... I got no problem sending the ball back over the net waiting for the next play... soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
Larry NCKS 02-08-2010 13:25:43 205.188.116.19 462902 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to john in la, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   fostersfarm said: (quoted from post at 15:22:46 02/08/10) Dad bought this new in '64 and it has stayed in the family. I think this setup is factory. I'm in CA so not much need for preheating. Thanks Soundguy, Foster The '58 through '64 diesel used a relay to energize the glow plugs. This relay is mounted up under the left side of the dash. A push button switch is located outboard the key switch under the dash to energize this solenoid and thus the two manifold mounted glow plugs. So yes, your '64 diesel should have two relays that are factory.   [Reply]   [No Email]
Ultradog MN 02-08-2010 14:44:11 70.59.81.62 462907 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to Larry NCKS, 02-08-2010 13:25:43   Larry is correct. The second solenoid is for the manifold heaters.   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-08-2010 11:33:55 173.6.84.199 462888 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 11:31:22   is this machine a diesel with a therml starting aid? soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
fostersfarm 02-08-2010 11:38:15 71.110.145.16 462889 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to soundguy, 02-08-2010 11:33:55   It is a diesel. Thermal starting aid-don't know. Is that to preheat the glowplugs? What would it look like?   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-08-2010 11:50:49 173.6.84.199 462893 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 11:38:15   at a minimum, look for plugs in the intake with wires running to them. I'm not familiar with the options of the industrial models, so just speaking in general terms here. soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
fostersfarm 02-08-2010 12:05:19 71.110.145.16 462895 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to soundguy, 02-08-2010 11:50:49   I think the 3ft black wire ran to the two plugs in the intake manifold but don't remember as I removed the wires in '93.   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-08-2010 12:08:18 173.6.84.199 462896 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 12:05:19   if they did, then that was likely the scheme the prev owner used for energizing the thermal start aid. soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]
fostersfarm 02-08-2010 12:22:46 71.110.145.16 462899 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to soundguy, 02-08-2010 12:08:18   Dad bought this new in '64 and it has stayed in the family. I think this setup is factory. I'm in CA so not much need for preheating. Thanks Soundguy, Foster   [Reply]   [No Email]
soundguy 02-08-2010 14:29:26 69.34.85.117 462904 Report to Moderator	Re: '64 4000 (4cy) dual relays in reply to fostersfarm, 02-08-2010 12:22:46   Never said it wasn't factory.. just said that was likely the scheme used to run the thermal start aid. soundguy   [Reply]   [Send Email]