Hydraulics for an I-4?

Drew W. · Mar 14, 2015

Hey everyone! I'm still shopping around for a loader to go on my '46 I-4 and the only sticking point that I am running into how to put a hydraulic pump on my C-152 engine. Will a hydraulic pump off of 300 Utility or the pump off of a Super-series engine mounted between the distributor and engine block fit on my engine? What other options do I have to get a pump on the engine besides using a coupling and mounting it off of the crank snout where the hand crank goes?

Thanks for your help!
Drew W.

Janicholson · Mar 14, 2015

The mounting bolt pattern is incorrect for the later IH pump. The timing gears are also weak and can fail (causing the engine to stop instantly).
The solution is to use a front engine cover from a SW-4 or late 1950 or 51 or newer W or I-4. these have the correct bolt pattern. (I don't think, but do not know, if the cover from a late H or SH will fit a W series.)
The timing gears need to be changed to increase the reliability in any case, so changing the cover is necessary to access the gears. The relocation of the bolt holes to accommodate the pump (hole is about 1/2 hole off, and is repaired by inserting a stud into the existing threads using locktite stud and bearing mount, then sawing it off flush and redrilling the hole and threading as needed to match the the pump. Jim

rustyfarmall · Mar 14, 2015

Personally, I like the idea of mounting it out front, with a shaft through the hand crank hole. I would use a Vickers type vane pump.

ih2656 · Mar 14, 2015

I have a i4 hyd pump

D Slater · Mar 14, 2015

At one time the parts were made to mount a pump in front powered off the crankshaft on a I-4. If you could mount one it would run a loader better than the 300 pump.

mkirsch · Mar 16, 2015

I-4s and W-4s are rare as hens' teeth to begin with, let alone finding a specific post-1950 model that's sitting in a parts yard with the correct front cover for the IH pump.

That is one needle in a haystack that could take you years/forever to find.

Your best bet is fabricating up something to drive a generic pump from the crankshaft.

Drew W. · Mar 16, 2015

(quoted from post at 18:37:26 03/14/15)
Personally, I like the idea of mounting it out front, with a shaft through the hand crank hole. I would use a Vickers type vane pump.

I was thinking that would be the easiest and most serviceable route to take. Could I use the 5/16" set screws in the crank snout as shear pins for a shaft coupling to go to the pump or should I put a shear pin out on the coupling going to the pump itself?

rustyfarmall · Mar 17, 2015

(quoted from post at 19:02:42 03/16/15)

(quoted from post at 18:37:26 03/14/15)
Personally, I like the idea of mounting it out front, with a shaft through the hand crank hole. I would use a Vickers type vane pump.

Click to expand...

I was thinking that would be the easiest and most serviceable route to take. Could I use the 5/16" set screws in the crank snout as shear pins for a shaft coupling to go to the pump or should I put a shear pin out on the coupling going to the pump itself?

I understand what you are asking, but I don't know the answer. Might want to incorporate one of those "LoveJoy" couplers into the shaft somehow.

Drew W. · Mar 17, 2015

(quoted from post at 14:21:44 03/17/15)

I understand what you are asking, but I don't know the answer. Might want to incorporate one of those "LoveJoy" couplers into the shaft somehow.

That would be a definite part in there. I'd have to put a Lovejoy/spider coupling on the crank side and a straight coupling on the hydraulic pump to help support the shaft.

I could also put a rubber "bellows" coupling between the pump and crank and it would fail before the screws on the crank snout failed. Looks like I have some figuring to do before buying a pump.

rustyfarmall · Mar 17, 2015

(quoted from post at 09:52:51 03/17/15)

(quoted from post at 14:21:44 03/17/15)

I understand what you are asking, but I don't know the answer. Might want to incorporate one of those "LoveJoy" couplers into the shaft somehow.

Click to expand...

That would be a definite part in there. I'd have to put a Lovejoy/spider coupling on the crank side and a straight coupling on the hydraulic pump to help support the shaft.

I could also put a rubber "bellows" coupling between the pump and crank and it would fail before the screws on the crank snout failed. Looks like I have some figuring to do before buying a pump.

The engineering is a big part of the fun. Not too long ago I installed a Vickers belt driven pump on my 1940 M. Made all the mounting brackets from scratch, using what was on the "possibles" pile. Did some real head scratchin. Thought I had it all figured out. Did a mock up by just tack welding the various pieces and then trial fitting them on the tractor. Ended up throwing most of that bracket on the scrap pile and started all over again. That whole project kept me occupied for several months.

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

Here my 2 Cdn cents, not worth a lot these days. My Grandfather got this SW6(1953) in 55'. No factory hyd's, so he had a pto mounted char-lyn setup. Any time needed to use pto, the pto pump had to come off. Sometime in the 70's my Dad put a hyd pump off the front of the engine. It worked till I had enough of the worn out system 2 years ago. The ram is very slow, the hyd pump leaked more oil than it pumped. So I redid the whole system. The drive shaft has been on the front of the engine for 45 yrs without any issues, no u joint, no love joy couple etc. I had local machine shop make up a new shaft, new pin for the crank shaft. I cut up the mounting plates.

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

I know lots people wont like that there is no cushion in the drive line. Its been setup like this for over 45 yrs, not going to reinvent the wheel on this one.

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

This is gear pump, I had to go with a 20 gpm pump. As the SW6 engine only turns at 1450 rpm max. I learned that I don't know very much about hyd's while doing this. At 1450 rpm, this pump makes around 12 to 13 gpms, for single ram on the blade it works just fine.

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

Redturbo · Mar 17, 2015

[/img]

Drew W. · Mar 18, 2015

Thank you redturbo! Seeing your setup is exactly what I was thinking that I was going to have to do. Looks like all I'll have to fabricate is a pump bracket for the front and mill a slot in a keyed shaft coupler.

Hydraulics for an I-4?

Drew W.

Member

Janicholson

Well-known Member

rustyfarmall

Well-known Member

ih2656

New User

D Slater

Well-known Member

mkirsch

Well-known Member

Drew W.

Member

rustyfarmall

Well-known Member

Drew W.

Member

rustyfarmall

Well-known Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Redturbo

Member

Drew W.

Member

Similar threads