Farmall A steering box

I am going to ask this again becasue I wasn't clear on some of the responses I got from an earlier post and its more than likly the way I asked the original question that got things a bit mixed up.

I was wondering if the later style steering gear and shaft that is tapered and keyed along with the pitman arm replace the ealier style gear and square shaft that I have in a 1944 A? I plan on replacing all bearings asd seals with new, but I have good doner parts from a later box that looks like they might work in the earlier box. The later pitman arm is correct to work with the tie rod ends on the tractor.


Thanks, Keith

Keith, I don't think I can make it more clear, but I can sure make it less clear for ya!
First of all, most of the slop that I have seen in the Farmall A steering has been from a bad top bearing, or the pitman arm being loose on the shaft. Even with different gears, you will probably have some play though.
You have a 1944 A, well what is the donor tractor? And, how do you know the donor has not been repaired over the years with parts from an A, Super A, or a 100, or a 130 or 140? To the best of my knowledge, there are three different steering "worm wheel shafts", which some people might call a quadrant shaft. There are also three different worm wheel or quadrant gears.
The shafts, as you know, can be square or tapered, and the key ways could be 1/4" or 3/16". The square bottom shaft is not drilled for a cotter pin at the bottom and has no bottom keyway.
The gears, could be 1/4" keyway or 3/16" keyway, and there was a Farmall 140 "fast steering" worm wheel gear with a different number of teeth.
Now, the two bearing, two bushings, two seals, and gasket fit all models from A through 140.
So, best advise I can give you is to take the donor apart, and compare to the pieces you have. Measure the keyways, count the teeth on the gears. The gears can be pressed off of the shaft.
For your instance, the keyway size should not matter unless you need to press the gear off one shaft and replace it, but the number of gears on the worm wheel are your concern. Best Regards.

Yes it should work fine, although i would not re-use the bushings, seals, bearings and gaskets. Even if it seemed tight when removed, I would go ahead and replace all those parts while you have it apart.....especially when the kit is only about $65. You'll have to have the bushing machined down a little bit to fit your shaft perfectly but that isn't a big deal. That is the way they make them. The only reason you should change out the internal parts like you are talking about is only becuase you'd not want to keep the square shaft setup. Otherwise they'll be fine as they don't typcially wear out.

The parts you need are bearings,bushings,gaskets and probably a new key NOT parts from another steering system.

A's and early Super A's had the square-ended shaft and the steering arm that was supposed to clamp tight with a bolt. It worked, but wasn't the best idea.

Later Super A's got a tapered shaft and a different steering arm to fit to it. At one time IH either recommended these parts be used to replace the earlier square shaft/arm when replacing parts on the earlier SA's and A's, or discontinued the square ended shaft/arm so you didn't have a choice in the matter.

Later yet Super A's, the 100's and 130's got conventional style tie rod ends. That steering arm was only made for a tapered shaft (same tapered shaft as in the last paragraph). You would need the tapered shaft, the arm, both spindle arms and a set of tie rods to switch to that. The spindles may be different, too.

The 140 is the same idea as the late SA/100/130, but the size of the keyway in the shaft that holds either the steering arm or the steering gear to that shaft is different. It could be both keyways/keys. It's been a while since I've fiddled with one. I think, and that's a big "I THINK" that if the shaft, gear, and arm are all changed the parts from the 140 can be used on earlier tractors.

The high-crop tractors used a different steering arm with a deeper drop. I think the tractors that were equipped with the heavy front axle may have used the arm with a deeper drop as well.

If you're doing a rebuild, get the bushings and gasket from CIH. Bearings and seals should be able to be sourced elsewhere if desired, if not CIH should still have those too. IIRC the bushings in the aftermarket "kit" that's available have to be sized to fit the shaft.

AG

Not in this '44 - it has over half a turn of play that can be seen in the shaft out of the bottom of the box to the pitman arm joint. So when I R&R the box I am goig to use the parts that are in a donor 47 that had real tight steering, and the newer style tapered shsft and arm. I wasn't sure if the steering box castings were the same between the two though that's all, becasue I planned on rebuilding the '44s castings.

Great info, thanks - this is exactly the info i needed. I guess the '47 box I am going to use the tapered shaft and arm out of must of had its steering rebuilt near the end of its life becasue from what you describe it sounds like it had the square shaft when new, but now has the tapered and keyed shaft. Might explain why it is so tight, might not have seen a lot of use after that repair.

(quoted from post at 03:15:51 02/13/14) Great info, thanks - this is exactly the info i needed. I guess the '47 box I am going to use the tapered shaft and arm out of must of had its steering rebuilt near the end of its life becasue from what you describe it sounds like it had the square shaft when new, but now has the tapered and keyed shaft. Might explain why it is so tight, might not have seen a lot of use after that repair.

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Once you remove the parts from the inside of the box don't forget to Unbolt the retainer for the top bearing. Sometimes the lock ring is broken and will allow the shaft to come out without unbolt ing the inside retainer. That, along with a worn top bearing describe the issues with play you are having. Good luck!

Of course it has play thats why you need to rebuild it i have rebuilt too many of them to count and with bushings and bearings seals and probaly new key it will be like new again.