Tisco sleeve and piston set woes

I am overhauling my Farmall M. Purchased a Tisco sleeve and piston set (made in Taiwan according to the label), and it has been one grief after another.

I use my M to farm 160 acres. I last overhauled in 1984.

When I put the sleeves in back in 84, I could basically just press them in by hand.

But these Tisco sleeves I had to whack in with a hammer and block of wood. Thank God none cracked. But I hope I don't have to get them out again in my lifetime.

Then tonight I am trying to assemble the pistons o the rods. NO WAY I can get the new pins into the new pistons! It should be a very light press fit, right? I don't remember having any trouble when I did this with the set back in 1984.

What happened to companies caring about quality? Do they think the ONLY thing the customer is interested in is the price??? They take a look at China and India, and don't care a hoot about taking jobs away from Americans and contributing to the trade deficit. All they see when they look at outsourcing to China and India is: "Man! Dig those low wages and lack of regulation!"

Sorry for the rant, but I need to get my M back together for harvest. Do you think I should get a new sleeve/piston set, because what else will I run into with these puppies?

Try heating the pistons to about 125° F and then install the pins. If the pins are a slip fit at room temperature with aluminum pistons they will be too loose at operating temperature.

Owen:

Thanks so much for the advice. I used a hair dryer to heat the piston, and put the pin in the refrigerator for awhile to cool it down, and it went in perfectly.

Are they supposed to be that tight?

Anyway---your advice was priceless! Thanks for getting me on the right track, and hopefully your post will help others.

They are fitted very close but will have plenty of clearance at running temps.

Sleeves are also interference fit, Cold in freezer and warm engine bore (Heat lamp. or propane torch for 10 minutes. Then they drop in, and swell to fit. (intentional for good thermal transfer and size control) Jim

Sounds right to me. Ive rebuilt probably 20 - 25 M engines and have never seen one where the sleeves slid in by hand, or the pistons pins go super easy in.

Yup, standard practice is to put the sleeves in the freezer. They would've dropped right in.

Now you owe the Taiwanese an apology.

...and yes, the vast vast majority of customers ONLY care about PRICE. How many threads have we had on this forum where people are complaining about the price of some tractor parts, and are looking for "cheaper" alternatives? They want the lowest price on rebuild kits, etc.. No mention of quality.

If you don't have the cheapest price, you will lose out to another company. Even if you're the only game in town, they'll go to the Internet or someone else will open up down the street selling cheaper than you.

Standing by the .1%-ers who will pay extra for quality is a death sentence for any business these days.

Don't have any idea what tisco recommends for sleeve interference. Several thin wall sleeve manufactures for those engines used to recommend they push in by hand around one half to three quarters of the length. More IH and old perfect circle thinwall sleeves than not would slide in around half by hand on ones I installed. Depends on the letter stamped by the bore.
Always pays to check the bore after the sleeves are in. Last thinwall sleeves I installed only went in about 4 inches by hand. After measuring the pistons and running a bore gage 2 of them were at the bare minimum for wall clearance.

I have put in multiple Tisco engine kits and I always freeze the sleeves and pins and I use diesel fuel poured into the water jacket (about 1.5 to 2 quarts) and end then light the fuel after the sleeves have been in the freezer for about 4 hours. I then use a propane torch to heat the pistons and the pin end of the rod after I get the sleeves in the block and then proceed to put the piston and rods together. This trick has worked every time for me. And on another note Tisco has 4 different engine kits that fit a M. Some times if you go by the serial number plate for the tractor you may get the wrong kit always go by the serial number that is stamped on the engine and even then you can still get the wrong one.

I'm going to be different about how I install those sleeves. I have sleeve and block same temp. Block cleaned very good but no honing. I use a sleeve installer so I know how they actually fit as I can feel the pressure all the way in. They will vary a lot but I don't want them too tight or too loose by feel and experience over the years. A must to check piston clearance in sleeve, all the way around , after installation. They are coming in all sizes, actually always have but not as bad as recently.

I had a set of sleeves for 706 gas years ago. One sleeve was broken in shipping. Put the five in, got one new one. These were IH, same number. Totally different fit. I always try sleeves in all bores and try to decide which one fits bore best.

Far as piston pin fitting, just putting the piston in hot water , blow off, oil and insert pin.

have bead brush honed (glaze breaker) the block lightly, wipe out with marvel oil, freeze sleeve, they drop in nice. tight sleeve in block, can mean tight sleeve on piston. ive honed the sleeves after installing tight sleeves. makes a difference. these are on the red power sleeve n piston sets.

My point is you want a nice tight sleeve and by freezing them you don't really know how tight it is.

Then you check the piston clearance and it may very well be necessary to rigid hone the new sleeve for a proper fit. Especially red power sleeves.

I also hone the block if sleeve is too tight and requires too much pressure to install. That is unusual on the old tractors though. I installed a lot of .002 oversize sleeves in the smaller diesels and that requires some honing.

With all the heavy press sleeved engines where the head gasket does not contact the sleeve, it is imperative the sleeve fits properly to stay in place.