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650 pull starts on gas only

A

Anonymous-0

Well-known Member
My 650 pull starts on gas.It will not start with starter..It has spark,gas in carb,the plugs are dry..looking for opinions... thanks
 
Assumes it is a Gasoline engine.
Poor battery cables, weak battery, or poor ignition switch are probable cause items. Battery voltage when cranking must be 10.8 volts or more. If not the coil will not get enough voltage to operate. Voltage drop happens when the wires are too small OOgauge needed. battery needs to be able to crank it with lively turnover, Not RRRrrrRRR.
A dragging starter motor will also make this happen.
The fact that it runs when pulled, indicates it is getting sufficient fuel. (assumes choke is working and being used) Jim
 
After reading your prior post I assume it is a diesel. The same issues still cause the problem. Unless the ignition shutoff switch on the intake switch over shaft is working incorrectly. Jim
 
I have a 650 that I couldn't get started on gas. Most times the diesel engine needs warmed up before it will start while pulling it. I tried pulling it and starting it on the diesel side, no such luck. Then switched it to gas and still no luck, thought it may have been electrical problem. Switched back to diesel, while being pulled I kept moving the throttle. In a certain spot it would fire. Once I found the right spot it finally started on diesel. Seems like something in the switch over was stuck. I drove it around till the steering would only work in one direction. Once I got it back to the shop I thought what the heck and went to shut it off on gas, wasn't expecting it to run but it purred like a kitten on gas. Been starting like a charm since.
caseman-d
 
(quoted from post at 20:36:27 10/01/11) I have a 650 that I couldn't get started on gas. Most times the diesel engine needs warmed up before it will start while pulling it. I tried pulling it and starting it on the diesel side, no such luck. Then switched it to gas and still no luck, thought it may have been electrical problem. Switched back to diesel, while being pulled I kept moving the throttle. In a certain spot it would fire. Once I found the right spot it finally started on diesel. Seems like something in the switch over was stuck. I drove it around till the steering would only work in one direction. Once I got it back to the shop I thought what the heck and went to shut it off on gas, wasn't expecting it to run but it purred like a kitten on gas. Been starting like a charm since.
caseman-d
Click to expand...

I would guess the grounding switch was hanging up in that case (or something dealing with spark)
 
carb needs a good cleaning. check the fuel adjustment orifice for plugging. this includes the small hole at the top of the brass tube inside the carb. an acetylene tip cleaner works well. they don't turn over very fast and they need a good shot of gas to get going.
to check if it is the carb you can pour a little gas directly into the intake after you take off the air cleaner pipe right above the carb. it'll probably run for a few seconds at a time until you clean the carb properly.
 
Have your battery checked to see if it has a weak cell. If it's ok your starter may be dropping the battery voltage as Jim suggested.
When you pull start it you're bypassing the starter. Hal
 
Brand new 800 cc amps battery. The short cable from solenoid to starter got hot...I think I will replace cables (old)
 
That's probably a good idea is to replace the battery cables. Old welding cable makes good battery cables using soldered lugs. Clean all those areas where your battery cables connect including where your battery is grounded. Hal
 
Update Gents...took pipe off above carb and poured gas in and it fired up with starter and ran... needs carb cleaning???I noticed it is leaking fuel by injectors...O rings?? where can I get those thanks for all the help..
 
ya might get by with screwing the fuel adjustment jet out and cleaning the passage all the way into the main jet with a small wire or acetylene tip cleaner. but it would probably be a good idea to take carb off and clean it up proper. it might sound like more work but it's actually easier to take the whole intake manifold off to access the carb and take it off. one carb nut is very ignorant to take off while it's on the tractor. another good reason to take the manifold off is now you can make sure that the switchover butterfly valves are opening and CLOSING COMPLETELY and not sticking. if they don't close all the way there isn't enough vacuum to suck gas up into the cylinders.
 
Brad,I checked into the gaskets(2) $20 is there another type of sealer that is gasoline resistant that you would recommend...thanks again.
 
Sometimes those orings will swell up when they see diesel again and not leak. I would get it running first before I go nuts throwing parts in it.

Those carbs are ridiculously simple. I would try and clean it quick from the outside just so I didn't have to buy/wait for gaskets and because it is a PITA to put back on. (Yes, the back nut...)
 
(quoted from post at 00:28:43 10/04/11) Brad,I checked into the gaskets(2) $20 is there another type of sealer that is gasoline resistant that you would recommend...thanks again.
Click to expand...

Steiner's has the gasket. Be glad you can get it. 5 years ago they didn't make a single part for that carb.
 
it's a pretty simple gasket. try and save as much as you can of the old one(even if it comes off in parts) and trace it on some gasket paper or if you're in a pinch a cereal box or some other cardboard that comes close to matching the thickness of the gasket. cut it out and put it up against the bowl and do some final trimming. if you feel you'll need some more gaskets in the future now is the time to trace that one a few more times! BTDT! Brad
 
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