D188 in a IH 504 Starter ring gear puzzle

Pandora 504 · Feb 8, 2011

My 504 has chewed up the flywheel ring gear so I need to replace it. After a little digging I found that the # of teeth was changed from 134 to 133 at serial#13676. Also the starter drive was changed at the same time,I am guessing to change gear ratio to improve starting. Does anybody know anything about this? I am wondering if I can use the later(133 teeth) ring gear on my current flywheel with the newer starter. Parts book does not list flywheel without the ring gear so I dont know if it is the same. Thanks for any advice you might offer.

sflem849 · Feb 8, 2011

Call your dealer. I would guess if it would work it would all sub to the updated and improved version. The parts book and online parts lookup doesn't show this all the time, but the dealers computer will. They also have the potential to look up if it will cross and their computer doesn't list it. They only do that if they like you

They also just might know! After all it is their business.

pete 23 · Feb 8, 2011

I and others have been discussing that very thing on 656 gas. I determined that the 656 I have apart right now has a 9 tooth starter drive and a 134 tooth ring gear number 367042R1 and flywheel number 388302R1 which is not listed for 656 in latest parts catalog BUT is listed on the 460 if that helps. Catalogs are very confusing on this issue. A service bulletin was issued in about 1966 or 7 addressing this change but dealers don't seem to have that old a bulletin in their computer. My set of bulletins are not complete.

Pandora 504 · Feb 9, 2011

Thank you for both for your help.Pete,the part # for 656 ring gear is the same as the 134 teeth gear for my 504.At any rate Messick~s had that one availble so I have ordered one from them. It is a little puzzling that none of the parts stores including this site show a serial # break for the replacement starter. I can easily see how the wrong starter drive could chew up the ring gear if they didnt mesh properly due to wrong tooth count. That very thing may have happened on my 504,the id tag on the starter is facing down and away from clear veiw.Will check it soon . Thanks for you help.

Owen Aaland · Feb 9, 2011

I don't know for sure if the ID of the two ring gears are the same or not. What we have determined here lately is that if you have a 134 tooth ring gear you need a 9 tooth starter drive. If you have a 133 tooth ring gear you need a 10 tooth starter drive. I don't know how much difference it makes going from 9/134 to 10/133 ratios. I do know that either the 9 or 10 tooth drives can be used in either starter.

In my engine book for the C263 in the 656 it shows a direct replacement of the 133 tooth for the 134 tooth gear. But it has a part number of 388302R2 instead of 367042R1 for the 134 tooth ring gear so maybe there is a difference.

D188 in a IH 504 Starter ring gear puzzle

Pandora 504

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sflem849

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pete 23

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Pandora 504

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Owen Aaland

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