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300 acres corn soybeans, what HP tractor

A

Anonymous-0

Well-known Member
I mention what horsepower tractor because that drives the size of equipment it may pull. Here is the background information.

Looking into taking over the family farm. 300 acres corn and soybeans south east Nebraska. Non irrigated. Some terraces. On the interior slopes he put corn, beans, and hay ( cause he ran Herefords ). Not looking at the farm being my only source of income, meaning I am not going to completely quite my day job as a software engineer. I want to more or less cover the ground at a reasonable speed with perhaps some less expensive large older equipment. Curious what suggestions you pros have in regards to venturing into this. This is something I want to try my hand at and I am not looking to be talked out of it. I have thought about it for 10 years. The farm has been share cropped the last 20 years and if no one in our family gives it a go, eventually it will go. And I hate to see it sold, as it would be waaaaaaaay too expensive, to be read impossible, to ever buy that much land again. So real advice on how to approach it sensible would be greatly appreciated.
 
Depends on how valuable your time is. Honestly if you're looking at tilling the land IE all 300 acres, then I would look at something around 100 hp tractors at the drawbar. Yeah you can get by with something like a 560 or something like that but it won't be super fast going. A 806 is probiably the base where I'd start looking. Not to mention in your parts of the country it will be alot easier to find parts for the larger impliments than it will the smaller stuff. Somebody else might have another opinion on this but that's my take on it.

Also wanted to add, obviously the less land your tending the less tractor you would really need. Technically you could do with with a Farmall H or M (many folks did it for many years) but you won't be getting it done. Being you are doing this in conjunction with your regular job you gotta get in get out get it done and have as few mechanical problems as possibly (although I believe that Murphy was also farmer which is why we have his laws to go by)
 
thanks kossuth

yeah, I want to get in, get out, and get it done. My grandpa did do it with an M Farmall. Though I heard he was on that tractor seat plowing the whole month of October sometimes. Not wanting that much seat time. Good suggestion on HP requirement. 100 horse power. Gotcha. Also, I am open to any model or equipment brands which are just dead simple and least problemetic.

My brother mentioned I could rent no-till drills from the coop, and I am sure a 100 hp can pull a 10-15 ft no till drill without problem. For the soybeans. For the corn, how many row planter is good for a 100 hp tractor, or what is a bomb proof planter?
 
100 to 150 hp in an older tractor would work fine providing the quality/reliability of the tractor and equipment is good. 100 hp is a little lite for 8 row equipment, even with today's farming practices. Poor reliability will lead to frustration and the crops may suffer from timeliness of operations.
 
If it were me... depending on what you want to spend of course.. I would be looking for something along the lines of an IH 1086 (around 120 HP) with cab and air for all those acres.. will pull a 21 or 23 foot disc all day long at a good clip, also would look into a less expensive 75 horse tractor or so and look for an older air IH cyclo-air 6 or 8 row planter. Pretty accurate and rarely have problems. If you go with something newer that has meters, you have to get the meters calibrated yearly and they run anywhere from 100-150 a row just for that. With 300 acres, you"re right about where I am at.. and I would not be going with a gas machine as it will not be cost effective. (Less difference now with the difference in fuel prices, but the fuel economy is still making diesel the better deal.)
 
You have a full time job, therefore you need the biggest tractor you can afford. Minimum 150 HP. Your granpaw did it with an M, but he spent weeks and months on a tractor seat. If you are doing it part time you need the HP, particularly when you are talking about row crops.
 
Awesome, that is good to find out. I like specifics, like your mention of an IH cyclo-air 6 or 8 row planter. Any other specifics you pros have is greatly appreciated. Are people cultivating corn anymore? Or they have the coop spray it? Just curious if by mention of having a smaller 75 hp tractor if that is for the purpose of having a row cropping tractor for cultivating rows.
 
with 300, you will probably be doing primary tillage and planting. hire out the combining. buying a combine for that size farm is a money pit. you can no till corn and beans, hire out the spraying. do you have grain storage and a dryer? jd 7000 is a good solid planter, easy to get parts for. working full time and nite and weekend farming, you need at least 100 hp, maybe up to 180 hp, depends on whats in your area. older case and allis chalmers can be bought cheaper than an i-h or jd. a second tractor with a loader is almost a must have too.
 
So a fella does not need an offset disk, plows and what not? Just no-till a corn and soybean rotation? Yes, we have 2 large grain bins, each with dryers. Really old. They have vertical augers on a track wich travel in a circle in the bins. Pretty nice. Probably 1000 bushel capacity each. Likely have not been turned on in 20 years. But I can hire an electrician to wire them up and give them a go. So if a fella follows corn with soybeans, he can use the JD 7000 planter or an IH cyclo air planter to plant the corn without tillage? I suppose every few years is good to run a mulcher or some type of tillage equipment. Likely following corn? So I asked before, but did not get an answer. Do people cultivate row crops anymore? Or they spray. I know beans in that area are commonly drilled and corn is rowed. But asking if there is a need to additionally purchase a smaller horsepower row crop to cultivate corn, or beans if I choose to plant them in rows.
 
arod,Just for conversation,My best friends grandfather and his brother worked a full time job at the local feed mill,6 days a week and farmed very sucessfully 300 acers with a Farmall B and C tractor,They worked hard and long hours,and made payments on the farm untill it was paid off.He died at 93 and his wife is still living at 97

jimmy
 
Well, if you are going to do tillage prior to planting, and do it by yourself, planting 300 ac with 6 row equipment will take 8-10 days. I would hire the spraying done and have the fertilizer spread.
Nitrogen for the corn can be put on with the spray (liquid N) or knifed in (NH3). If you are tilling, two tractors is a must, one to till and one to leave hitched to the planter. I use a JD 4630 (150 hp) to till and a JD 4010 (80 hp) to plant. The 4010 pulls the JD7000 6 row 30" planter.

To harvest, I use a JD6620 combine with a 6 row corn head and a 218 bean head. The 218 is 18 ft and will do 7 rows of 30 inch rows. If you are handy, an old combine will work, you just have to fix it prior to fall. If you are not handy, hire it done.

You will find that you never have enough "stuff" or enough sheds to put it all in but man, the toys you will have......LOL
 
sounds like your bins have stir-rators in them, 2000 bushel wont be enough storage for 300 acres. a chisel plow, field cultivator with a tine harrow, and possibly a disk. if you get bad soil compaction, you will need to fall chisel plow, then hit it with a field cultivator in the spring. rare if anybody cultivates. if you are going to conventional till, get a rotary hoe also. if the ground crusts over after planting, you may need to run the hoe to get the crop to break thru. keep an eye on what the neighbors farms are doing as far as tillage, your county extension office is a good source of information also.
 
You haven't told us who your partners in this venture are. It's an inheritance? Or whether they want to hire a complete novice to farm a million dollars worth of land. With 20 thousand dollars worth of old junk machinery?
I gather from your post that you are committed to do some "farming". Keep your day job.
Split the difference. Rent 200 acres. Farm 100 for 3 years. see how well you do. Talk to your tax CPA on benefits of depreciating new farm equipment. WOuld you rather pay the IRS taxes on 100k sales of crop or deduct it all for equipment?
Meanwhile start spending your nights reading the various state ag .EDU sites , watching RFDTV and hangin out at the truck stop where the real farmers go in the winter.
 
Would be family inheritance. And yeah, the farm is worth close to a million dollars. Good information on the tax benefits of depreciation I suppose most farmers set up an LLC or Corporation to shelter earnings and lower taxes. I will read up on that.
 
I didnt read all the replies, but we used to farm 600acres with 2 Ms and a bunch of wore out equipment. Took some work, mostly weekends and evenings, but we did it.
 
arod, the most important thing you should be looking for is a mentor, someone to show you the ropes.

It takes more than a big smile on your face and a 100HP tractor to "farm it."

Using the farm as a tax shelter and writing off a bunch of shiny new equipment is a nice idea, but that's assuming the crops are going to turn a profit. What if it's a bad growing year? You get to watch the equipment dealer load all your shiny new equipment up and take it away while the Sheriff stands next to you with his hand on his gun.

Not only will they load up the equipment, they'll load up your dignity, and your credit rating.

Even if it means giving Uncle Sam more than is absolutely necessary, stick with the plan of using equipment that you can afford with minimal proceeds from the farm. Odds are your first crop won't be optimal even if the growing conditions are ideal, because you don't know what you're doing.
 
I'd look around the area and see what is popular for a big older tractor, because parts should be easier to find. Cheap HP like a 1370 Case would be good. If IH is popular, look for something in an older IH of about the same size. JD is going to be high priced HP, you can get a good Case or IH 150 HP tractor for 1/2 of what JD that size would run. With that size tractor, you should be able to get in and out without spending every minute of your free time working, and you can probably buy the extra 50 HP for the same money as a 100 HP.
A friend of mine, that I worked with full time, farmed about 400 acres (wheat and milo) with a 720 JD and an old LA Case... finally bought a 1370 Case and found he had a lot more spare time.
 
Keep your day job and share-crop it or cash rent it! Add up the costs for the equipment and you will find you will be ahead letting someome else farm it.

If you share crop it, you can still participate in farming by paying for seed, fertilizer and storage while guessing when to sell your crops.
 
I farm,raise cattle,and like to buy and sell equiptment.The IH tractors seem to have the best horse power per dollar example,friend just bought nice 1066[150HP]for $6000.Nice older planters{7000 JD]bring about $300 per row and tillage equiptment [25ft or less is very reasonable]I quess harvesting and spraying would be better off being custom hired as the newer machines actually can save about what it costs with all the technology available.300acres wouldnt take that many days and would probably be fun when its not your main source of income.
 
We had a dairy farm and about 350 acres total (2/3 tillable). We did hay, corn, and grain.
For the last 10 years we used 2 ~60-70HP tractors (684 and 685) for most of the work - planting, spraying, fertilizing, all the hay, and general use. One had 4WD and a loader, the other was a straight 2WD (the one that we use mainly for everything). Easy to fix, cheap on fuel, low soil compaction, cheaper to buy, etc. but, probably a little slower to get everything done because of their/the machinery size (we had a 4 row John Deer 7000 (I think) corn planter.
We also had a 90HP 2WD 3288 that did all the disking (20FT International - duals helped a lot here), plowing (4X16" furrow), cutting corn, etc. Great field tractor, lots of power, still not to bad for soil compaction.
Only problem was the 3288 should have been a 4WD especially for plowing in the fall (we were on mainly clay), for getting into certain fields in the spring a little sooner, and for cutting corn.
A couple of tractors like this would do you great and still not be too costly - maybe go a little bigger (100-125HP) on the bigger tractor and the machinery you pull with it.

We also had an 815 Combine to do our own grain but if I were you, I'd hire somebody to do that and the spraying at least for the first couple of years (you'll have enough other headaches I'm sure).


Any machinery/tractors come with the farm if you take it over?
 
It is being cash rented and share cropped. Has been for 20 years. My mother and aunt own the farm. Unless one of us family members chooses to give it a go they will sell it come 5 - 10 years from now. They are not going to inherit 1/8th each to their respective children, that being 8 total. Then 8 kids will all bicker about some wanting to sell, others wanting to buy. Etc. Makes for bad blood. But if one, and only one of us shows interest and genuinely wants to give it our time and labor, then that person gets the farm. Currently that number is zero. And will remain so as no others have interest but me.
 
I would spend a lot of time with the fertilizer/ chemical dealer, extension, and implement dealer exploring the viability of no-till. If it looks like a ten out of ten year proposition then a 100 PTO hp tractor would be sufficient for a six row no-till planter or 15 foot no-till drill.
If conventional tillage (or minimum till) is forecasted to bring the most return then you need to figure the likely number of tillage trips. If most years the ground can be gotten ready with one trip in the spring (assuming some preparation was done in the fall) then probably a 100 PTO horsepower tractor with 15 foot implements would be sufficient. If it is like around here you may need three or four trips (not counting being rained out) and I would say you would want to think about 150 to 180 PTO horsepower with 21 foot implements. If the windows to work are small some springs then I would go closer to the 180. Since this an IH board maybe a 1486 w/ MFWD. It would be less than a Magnum or Deere 50 series row crop and should be found for under 18000 most of the time.
 
Definitely set up a meeting with your county agent. Also start talking to the FSA folks as there is a lot to learn and time lines for setting up operations and get any gov help. Same for crop insurance. Start studying seed and suppliers. Unless you are flush, begin talking to lenders who are going to want to see a long term farm plan from you. You will probably need to borrow anyway to buy out your family as they may not want to gamble with you at least for very long.

Around here, everyone is dodging the weather trying to get tillage and planting done. Sometimes the window only opens for a day or two and sometimes things just don't get planted. You can count on being low man on the coop rental list. Don't count on having a rental available at the time you need it. Same goes for harvest. Line up your custom cutters as you may be low man getting his crops harvested while working around weather delays. Quality and quantity goes down over time. Then the bugs, disease, and hail hits.

Talk to and work with your renter for a while, you may figure out he is worth his salt. After doing it for years he may have it figured out. You need to learn from him, see what he has for equipment, crop rotation issues, and how long he takes.

You can go to many dealers and sales and see how tractors and equipment sell. At the time you decide to bid and also match equipment to a tractor, the price will go up and the best equipment hard to find. Give yourself a year or two to accumulate equipment before letting your tenant go. State laws designate notice to tenants and when they can terminate an agreement. Some are as early as March to get someone out after harvest or else you cycle another year.

Good luck.
 
Yeah, have had the same cash renter for 20+ years. And they rock and roll and know how to make that farm explode with corn and beans. They definitely have a wealth of successful tactics and knowledge. True, My mother and Aunt may be hesitant to let me give it a go, if I fail hard, then they won't get enough profit in return to just pay the tax on the land. My brother told me start slow. just ask for one field, 40 acres. Do that for a year or two. Then ask for a second field, another 40 acres. Do it in steps so I learn without causing too much damage to my relatives or the share croppers who have succussfully managed the land for the last 20 years.
 
Currently zero family members want anything to do with it.
I don't want it selfishly for me alone, but everybody knows what happens when multiple people have ownership. Some want to sell, others want to buy them out but can't. So off slices 60 acres for housing development to the uncle that sold his portion. It is a losing choice to have multiple ownership in land.

I am of the opinion someone in the family should hold on to it. I am the only one with interest, so why not.
 
I wish you the best of luck with this project. I agree with your reasoning that since you are the only family member with an interest, you should give it a shot. Your brother may have a good idea about easing into it gradually, you would have more time to gather information and round up your equipment that way. I think buying older equipment is smart, but remember that condition is everything with that stuff, and it can take extra time to hunt out used equipment with enough life left in it so it doesn't nickel and dime you to death (took me over a year to find my 684, but it's been a jewel). Down here in the South, older high horsepower tractors generally sell cheaper than those in the 50-70 hp range - since the farms are smaller to start with and so many have been broken up over the last few decades, everybody wants the smaller ones for their hobby farms and few have the acreage to put a 100+ hp tractor to good use. You're also lucky in that the farm won't be your primary source of income, so the pressure to hit the ground running and succeed from day 1 won't be as great - as long as you can make enough to cover costs, keep the family happy, and hopefully pocket a little bit, you can ride out the building years and then grow your profits as you get a handle on things.
 
(quoted from post at 13:50:25 01/19/11) Currently zero family members want anything to do with it.
I don't want it selfishly for me alone, but everybody knows what happens when multiple people have ownership. Some want to sell, others want to buy them out but can't. So off slices 60 acres for housing development to the uncle that sold his portion. It is a losing choice to have multiple ownership in land.

I am of the opinion someone in the family should hold on to it. I am the only one with interest, so why not.
Click to expand...

I don't know your family history, but you pretty much won't make any money learning in farming on this scale. If you don't know a tractor from a crescent wrench, the internet won't help you. I wish you well, but don't think by your previous quesitons that you have enough to handle the farm on the side. You should listen to a lawyer and give a small farmer a chance in the area, not the first guy with the money.
 
I'm one of the guys that will tell you to go for it. If you start with decent equipment and fail you should be able to get back most of your money.

Don't listen to the guys about brands. Take a couple of days off and go sit in the local coffe shop and talk to the area farmers. They will tell you which dealerships are good and bad. Color of the paint isn't much help if the local dealer support isn't good. Also check, some parts are getting hard to find for older stuff. My BIL went through that with an AC last year on a 8070 AC. That's a tractor that was made in the 80's. Yea green paint is a little more expensive to buy but if that's the only good dealer in the area your hands may be tied. Here both the CaseIH and JD dealers are good so I have a choice. You really don't want to be driving 120 miles round trip to get parts when you are on a tight scedual. I'm running IH and Fords here. Would not turn down a deal on a JD. Wouldn't touch AC/White/Oliver/MF. Closest good dealer is 124 miles round trip. And I'm not working off farm.

As far as learning....coffee shop time again. Bet you can find a bored retired farmer that you can hire to help get you started. Someone who knows the local soil conditions.

If family fights over land start it could well end up in court with the whole works being sold. Seen it happen more than once.

Rick
 
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