350 Utility Temp Gauge Reading

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 9, 2009

The fan belt on my 350 Utility broke Sunday, and the engine got hot enough to boil the antifreeze. It overheated right away – blew steam within maybe two minutes after starting, and I got it back in the barn and shut off with only three or four minutes of total run time, so I don’t expect any serious damage. However…

The needle on the temp gauge (original-looking mechanical) was borderline between the “RUN” and “HOT” areas. Shouldn’t the needle on a tractor with boiling antifreeze be well into the “HOT” area? I have plenty of time right now to replace the gauge, so if you gents think that’s a suspicious reading I’ll do that.

Thanks in Advance --

Mark W. in MI

CNKS · Sep 9, 2009

Maybe, maybe not. I ran an H without antifreeze (it seldom got below 32 where I used to live, we just drained the radiator if freezing was forecast) that would force water out the overflow when the gauge was in that position. It was pressurized like your 350. I think those gauges either work or they don't. There also could be a delay in the actual temperature and what the gauge reads.

Charlie M · Sep 9, 2009

You antifreeze could be weak and that would cause it to boil at less than the temp gauge is set for.

Janicholson · Sep 9, 2009

In addition, the pressure cap changes the boiling point 4 degrees higher (approx) for every pound of cap pressure. If it had a bad cap, that would contribute. If there was boiling water in it coming out when you stopped, it will be fine. JimN

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 9, 2009

Thanks, Gents.

The antifreeze checks O.K. to about -40F, but that was a good thought. And you're right, Jim, about the radiator cap -- but I don't have a convenient way to measure what pressure it will hold (auto parts store, maybe?).

Just for fun I decided to check the [gasp!] operator's manual for my 300 Utility (close enough to a 350, I figure). It says the gauge should normally be "on the low side of the 'RUN' range". In other words, anything to the right of vertical is too hot.

So there we have it -- the gauge face really should have been designed so the entire right side (from vertical to the high limit) reads "HOT"; then it would agree with the operator's manual. And my needle would have been a good third of the way into the "HOT" area.

I'll probably just keep the gauge and live with the anomaly. Sometimes it's the little quirks that keep things interesting.

Thanks again to all --

Mark W. in MI

CNKS · Sep 9, 2009

The manuals don't always agree with the real world. If you have the correct gauge, any movement into the hot area means 212 degrees F. "Correct" temperature probably means about 180, which is likely the center of the green area. The H I drove in the 50's under most loads ran about 2/3's into the green under a full load. If it was a hot day and fully loaded, it would slowly move over to the red. Only way to prevent that was to shift down a gear. On the other hand, lightly loaded and cool weather will it will usually move barely into the green. My opinion is your gauge is reading correctly. Those tractors are cold-blooded, except when they are pushed, then they can and will run hot. Ours was generally run at its limits, except for cultivating.

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 10, 2009

Yes, that's been my experience too. I think this was the first time I'd seen the needle move beyond the cold/run boundary. So far I've only used the tractor for disking, dragging, and loader work so it hasn't had a chance to really heat up and show its muscles.

CNKS · Sep 10, 2009

Where are you from? -- I bet most people on this forum don't know what a drag is. Been on this forum since 98 or 99, never seen it mentioned. Pulled a 9 foot wide drag with the H. 4 or 5 cross pieces, it was maybe 20-25 feet long. That was the biggest load it had. Usually 3rd gear, probably should have run in 2nd more of the time. Typical for the H, load was too light for 2nd, borderline for 3rd, 4th out of the question 99% of the time. -- is that the drag you are talking about? This was in south Texas, common item there.

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 11, 2009

I'm from about ten miles north of Grand Rapids, MI. I guess the implement may have a formal name something like "spring-tooth drag harrow". I helped my uncle farm when I was a kid, and we always just called his a "drag". I think the Buckinghams even sang a song about it. ;-)

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 11, 2009

Sorry, I just re-read your question and I don't think I answered it very well. This particular drag is nine feet wide and about seven feet long, with three rows of spring teeth. The teeth are maybe a foot and a half apart across each row. There are a couple of levers that adjust the depth of the teeth in the soil. This one has a three-point hitch, but probably 80 percent of "drags" around here are just drag-behind devices.

mattofvinings · Sep 11, 2009

The general strategy I've seen for coolant temp gages on a number of automotive engines is to (ideally)

- read liquid temp when bathed by liquid

- read metal temp when no liquid

However, a very common occurrence is that when the liquid subsides from being low or boiled off, the probe reads air temp...which is unsuitably low.

My thoughts are that the temp probe should be like a flat puck that fits tightly against a machined area on the cylinder head, intake manifold, etc so that the water jacket bathes the area in a strong flow of coolant when OK and then you actually do read the metal temp when the liquid disappears.

So far this brilliant idea isn't in production anywhere in the world so take my confidence in its superiority with a few blocks of salt.

CNKS · Sep 11, 2009

Difference in terminology due to different parts of the country. You have a springtooth harrow. As you say many were usually pull behinds. I was speaking of a implement made out of 2X6 or 2x8 lumber (there are also steel ones) used for leveling for irrigation. It would drop soil into the low places. Worked very well for small non-level places caused by tillage. Most people doing flood irrigation these days use land planes.

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 12, 2009

(quoted from post at 17:27:00 09/11/09) The general strategy I've seen for coolant temp gages on a number of automotive engines is to (ideally)

- read liquid temp when bathed by liquid

- read metal temp when no liquid

However, a very common occurrence is that when the liquid subsides from being low or boiled off, the probe reads air temp...which is unsuitably low.

My thoughts are that the temp probe should be like a flat puck that fits tightly against a machined area on the cylinder head, intake manifold, etc so that the water jacket bathes the area in a strong flow of coolant when OK and then you actually do read the metal temp when the liquid disappears.

So far this brilliant idea isn't in production anywhere in the world so take my confidence in its superiority with a few blocks of salt.

I like that idea, Matt. you could place the sensor at (or very near to) the spot where you [u:ebc2d477e9]really[/u:ebc2d477e9] want to know the temperature. You may even decide you don't care about the coolant temp as long as you know the metal temp; then the sensor wouldn't have to contact the fluid (one less hole needed in the cooling system).

Mark W. in MI

Rumplestiltskin · Sep 12, 2009

That sounds like a great big version of the thing we use here to smooth the infields at ballparks. We would call that a drag, too.

350 Utility Temp Gauge Reading

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