- Thread starter Kelly C
- Start date
the tractor vet
Well-known Member
Well Kelly First off when that tractor was made and used reg gas was between 93 and 95 anywhere ya went second that it is a high rpm engine and considered high comp. and third the owners manual tells ya that min. req. is for 93 and if ya use 89- or 87 she will have pre ing can swell pistons and score liners lock up under load . Now also think about this just how old that tractor is and you have no idea just how many times that head has had .010-.020 taken off and this has upped the comp.and will add to the need for the 93 socalled high test of today. Also the timing is vary important on them so one must keep a close eye on it when one changes the points , 24 degrees at rated high idle on a 263 and 18 and no more then 20 on a 291 .
rustyfarmall
Well-known Member
The next problem is that 93 octane is no longer available in many places. It is very hard to find any stations around here that sell anything higher than 87. So do we just park those 706s, or what?
You probably ought to run Av gas just to be safe. Those high compression tractor engines...probably 8:1 and running outrageous RPM"s...in the three thousands can"t be abused with regular pump gas.....likely will self destruct.
Now, I don"t have a book or manual or calling from a Higher Power to hand down advice. But, unless you"re pulling the guts out of that 706, I doubt you"ll notice the difference between 87 and 93 octane gas. Ten to twenty cents a gallon isn"t all that much if fuel cost is all you that are considering.
8:1 compression is not high and three and four thousand rpms isn"t high either.......higher than what old tractors operated at....but still not high rpm"s.
High compression starts at around 9.5:1 and high rpm"s come in at 6,000 or better......neither of which you will find in working tractors of any vintage.
I wouldn"t buy 87 octane gas just to save 20 cents a gallon......but to use 93 octane gas because I thought it would destroy a 6 cylinder tractor engine due to high compression and rpm"s.....I think not.
Now, I don"t have a book or manual or calling from a Higher Power to hand down advice. But, unless you"re pulling the guts out of that 706, I doubt you"ll notice the difference between 87 and 93 octane gas. Ten to twenty cents a gallon isn"t all that much if fuel cost is all you that are considering.
8:1 compression is not high and three and four thousand rpms isn"t high either.......higher than what old tractors operated at....but still not high rpm"s.
High compression starts at around 9.5:1 and high rpm"s come in at 6,000 or better......neither of which you will find in working tractors of any vintage.
I wouldn"t buy 87 octane gas just to save 20 cents a gallon......but to use 93 octane gas because I thought it would destroy a 6 cylinder tractor engine due to high compression and rpm"s.....I think not.
John M
Well-known Member
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- Nunyafn business
I sure do hope youre not trying to disprove what TV says. Hes right even when proven wrong, ya know.
I wouldn"t use 87 octane for anything more than idling around at a tractor show. If you use the tractor for any work at all it needs at least 91 octane. The operator"s manual will tell you that. If you turn the key off when the engine is hot and it wants to keep running that"s telling you something, and it"s not good.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Kelly,
This will no doubt start a pee war, but put a little E85 in it to up the octane rating. Or dig deep and get some leaded Aviation gas.
This will no doubt start a pee war, but put a little E85 in it to up the octane rating. Or dig deep and get some leaded Aviation gas.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Rusty,
How far in the sticks are you ? Or, are you one who won't use 89/91 octane because it has demon ethanol ?
How far in the sticks are you ? Or, are you one who won't use 89/91 octane because it has demon ethanol ?
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
What about lead additive in gas? Does that make a difference? Does a person have to add lead additive to today's gas or just higher octane? My owner's manual for my 560 says to run a minimum of 90 octane research method /84 motor method. and it has the 263 in it, same as the 706. Now, what method is used in today's gas station pumps? I've had people around here tell me that just buy 87 and dump lead additive in it which is what i did the last time, but, i haven't put a heavy load on it yet. This seems to be a hot topic and was just wanting more info. I was just curious if it's the lead or the octane that makes the difference.
rustyfarmall
Well-known Member
Gary, I have been using E-10 in everything I own ever since it became available somewhere around 1980 or so with NO problems. The big push now is E-85, and since my local station has only 2 pumps, they took out the pump for the un-leaded regular and replaced it with a pump for E-85, so now we have the choice of E-10, or E-85, or diesel. Nothing else.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
KS,
Lead additive is a means to remove money from your pocket. Tetraethyl lead was a (GM funded) compound added to the poorly refined gas of the 20-30s to reduce ping/knock as compression and power went up. Octane is the real anti-knock solution. Most US pumps show "road" octane; research+motor/2(90+84/2=87). The lead was also a "cushioning" agent since it built up on exhaust seats/and parts, us old guys could tell how well/hard a car was run by how "white" the pipes were after a trip. Again additives are ONLY a way to seperate you and your money.
Lead additive is a means to remove money from your pocket. Tetraethyl lead was a (GM funded) compound added to the poorly refined gas of the 20-30s to reduce ping/knock as compression and power went up. Octane is the real anti-knock solution. Most US pumps show "road" octane; research+motor/2(90+84/2=87). The lead was also a "cushioning" agent since it built up on exhaust seats/and parts, us old guys could tell how well/hard a car was run by how "white" the pipes were after a trip. Again additives are ONLY a way to seperate you and your money.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
Rusty,
Same here, I grow corn so I use E10 and have dabbled with E85 and various combos of 85-10 (E42.5???) but here E10 is labeled 89 octane.
Same here, I grow corn so I use E10 and have dabbled with E85 and various combos of 85-10 (E42.5???) but here E10 is labeled 89 octane.
The main problem is the cast aluminum pistons that are only availiable for rebuilding these engines nowadays. When they were first manufactured IH used forged pistons. If you know anything about motors you know forged pistons are alot more consistent when they heat up. I have a 263 706. If I use it for light work on 87 its fine, but if I would run it hard say at 90% load on 87 the cast pistons would swell and score cylinders, BTDT! 87 octane burns fast creating allot of heat in the piston, more than it can get rid of causing it to swell. 93 octane burns much slower and cooler. If you don't believe the Vet get an IH 6 cylinder gasser hook it to a plow, put in 87 and go to work. I guarantee you will be hearing all kinds of strange noises as the cast pistons start transferring metal within a few hours..
Mark,
Everything is relative. When we say "high compression" we are comparing to compressions in the 6:1 ratio range. When we say "high RPM" we are comparing to the 1800 range.
So, an engine with an 8:1 compression ratio and running at 2600RPM is a high compression, high RPM engine in this context.
Jerry Gilliam
Member
I don't know about much, but I do know that I've used 87 octane in my 460 221 cc for over 23 years now and she is still doing fine. And yes, I've lugged her hard lots of times pulling a NH851 baler. If she blows, then let her. I now have a 263cc in a 656 and I'm using 87 octane in her. The local station doesn't have hi-test and I don't store gas any longer in my 300 gallon tank as it is just as cheap to let my local exon store it in their tanks. I'm not making an argument about the 93 versus 87 and I realize I'm not row croping now. I've sold my 1066 and big disc, etc. Just raising hay and cows. So for me to get involved in hunting and storing 93 for my tractors is not an option. If they blow, I'll overhaul them.
Jerry Gilliam
Jerry Gilliam
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